893 replies to this topic

[enderwigginau]

494 anyone?

[Toranavista]

Researching dealer code 589?

Still looking for any info on this code please.

589 BOWDEN'S GARAGE P/L I think.

Thanks for your info. I managed to track down one of the original owners after this was posted and he confirmed the dealer code as you suggest.

[Balfizar]

494 anyone?

Believe it started as W H Lober Miranda (# 77) then (1981 became Greg Ball Holden Sutherland) (#77) at 1 - 3 Kiora Road then migrated to 499 Princess Hwy (Pre 11/1994) as Greb Ball Sutherland # 77 and then Mc Grath Holden #494 still there today. Could be corrected if anyone has info.
494 NSW SUTHERLAND McGrath Holden (Sutherland ) current dealer :- 1/01/2011 499 -511 Princes Hwy 2232 (02) 9545 4811
Cheers
Balfizar

[Balfizar]

Don't have a vin disc, so can anyone tell me if these guys sold toranas,
I think they are period correct for 1969 - 1980, it may fill in some gaps,

I have not posted what I have from 320 and higher and the spreadsheet is too big for this site
it includes address, phone, start and finish dates, etcprobably 70 % complete records.

20 GILBERT & ROACH (now Suttons of Homebush)
32 McLeod Kelso and Lee (Newcastle)
33 NASH HOLDEN (Lakemba)
37 GLEN FULTON HOLDEN (Blayney) Blaney Holden 1/10/2002
54 YOUNG & GREEN (KOTARA branch NEWCASTLE)
66 Preston Motors City (South Melbourne)
68 PRESTON MOTORS ALBURY P/L
76 REG HUNT - RHODES Ltd (West Melbourne)
100 PHOENIX HOLDEN (Wanneroo)
124 GEOFF BRADY Motors (Glen Waverly)
125 PENINSULA HOLDEN (Mornington:- moved to NSW)
126 Ballan Holden (Werribee) (C L & M Ballan)
126 C.M. & L. BALLAN PTY LTD (Werribee)
128 MOTORS P/L (Hobart 1974 )
161 METRO MOTORS P/L (Morley)
173 ZUPPS P/L (ASPLEY)
310 Watsons (Greensborough)
311 ARNOTT'S MOTORS (Benalla)
313 Bendigo Motor Co (M. G. TAYLOR Pty Ltd Bendigo) Vic
315 R.L. & C.J. BALES (Birchip)
316 JARON MOTORS (Boort)
318 BILL PATTERSON-CHENEY melbourne Pty Ltd (South Melbourne)
320 CUSACK'S MOTORS (Castlemain Greg Cusack Motors later Greg Motors)

I have 767 dealer Id's identified and 612 unidentifies for a total of 1379
this includes all variants (changes of address,name,ownership, etc)



Cheers
Balfizar

Edited by Balfizar, 30 January 2011 - 05:15 PM.

[Balfizar]

Broadcast sheets reveal also

007 fleet order
225 fleet order
252 stock order

I think all Id's should be listed and torana selling dealers highlighted

Cheers
Balfizar

Edited by Balfizar, 31 January 2011 - 12:44 AM.

[slr5640]

Don't have a vin disc, so can anyone tell me if these guys sold toranas,
I think they are period correct for 1969 - 1980, it may fill in some gaps,

All these ones sold A9X
1977 era
the dealer numbers at least....

32 McLeod Kelso and Lee (Newcastle
33 NASH HOLDEN (Lakemba)
54 YOUNG & GREEN (KOTARA branch NEWCASTLE)
66 Preston Motors City (South Melbourne)
68 PRESTON MOTORS ALBURY P/L
124 GEOFF BRADY Motors (Glen Waverly)
128 MOTORS P/L (Hobart 1974 ) i have these guys as dealer 129
161 METRO MOTORS P/L (Morley) I have this as Shack motors freemantle
173 ZUPPS P/L (ASPLEY)

[slr5640]

missed one 252 sold an Aquarius A9X hatch

[enderwigginau]

494 anyone?

Believe it started as W H Lober Miranda (# 77) then (1981 became Greg Ball Holden Sutherland) (#77) at 1 - 3 Kiora Road then migrated to 499 Princess Hwy (Pre 11/1994) as Greb Ball Sutherland # 77 and then Mc Grath Holden #494 still there today. Could be corrected if anyone has info.
494 NSW SUTHERLAND McGrath Holden (Sutherland ) current dealer :- 1/01/2011 499 -511 Princes Hwy 2232 (02) 9545 4811
Cheers
Balfizar

I'm told that McGrath is incorrect and the name I've been given for 494 seems to fit right.
Thanks anyway.

Grant..

[Balfizar]

494 anyone?

Believe it started as W H Lober Miranda (# 77) then (1981 became Greg Ball Holden Sutherland) (#77) at 1 - 3 Kiora Road then migrated to 499 Princess Hwy (Pre 11/1994) as Greb Ball Sutherland # 77 and then in 2003 Mc Grath Holden #494 still there today. Could be corrected if anyone has info.
494 NSW SUTHERLAND McGrath Holden (Sutherland ) current dealer :- 1/01/2011 499 -511 Princes Hwy 2232 (02) 9545 4811
Cheers
Balfizar

I'm told that McGrath is incorrect and the name I've been given for 494 seems to fit right.
Thanks anyway.

Grant..

Interested in who you have for 494 and in what date, was part of the Lander Mc Grath group, now part of AHG . Definately 494 in 2003 Mc Grath.
However, 494 could have been a reissued number from the Mc Grath/Lander or AHG dealer ID that they used after the take over. Given the swapping nature of dealer ID's its best to ask dealer ID at a set point in time / car sale date.
That would help identify dealer and the ever changing location/suburb. Dealer ID's have changed owners,locations and names. Same locations have changed dealer ID,s owners and names and also dropped the Holden franchise.

So who was 494?

Cheers
Balfizar

[Balfizar]

Don't have a vin disc, so can anyone tell me if these guys sold toranas,
I think they are period correct for 1969 - 1980, it may fill in some gaps,

All these ones sold A9X
1977 era
the dealer numbers at least....

32 McLeod Kelso and Lee (Newcastle
33 NASH HOLDEN (Lakemba)
54 YOUNG & GREEN (KOTARA branch NEWCASTLE)
66 Preston Motors City (South Melbourne)
68 PRESTON MOTORS ALBURY P/L
124 GEOFF BRADY Motors (Glen Waverly)
128 MOTORS P/L (Hobart 1974 ) i have these guys as dealer 129
161 METRO MOTORS P/L (Morley) I have this as Shack motors freemantle
173 ZUPPS P/L (ASPLEY)

128 TAS HOBARTMOTORS P/L (Hobart 1974 ) 1/10/1977 1/10/2002 179 Macquarie Street 7000
129 TAS HOBARTMOTORS P/L (Hobart) 1/02/1988 1/01/2011 195 Macquarie St 7000Phone: (03) 6230 7300

129 franchise start date is 1/02/1988 and at 195 Macquarie 128 I have existing at least between the fates 1/10/1977 and 1/10/2002 and at address 179 Macquarie. 129 is current and confirmed.

161 WA MORLEY METRO MOTORS P/L (Morley) 1/12/1972 1/01/2011 212 Walter road(west), Morley 6062 (08) 9449 3522

I have 161 as Metro with a franchise starting date as 1/12/1972. However, I also have 161 as shacks of cockburn (unconfirmed) but they were not listed in a 1972 owners manual so it is conceivable the they are the predecessor or re-issue ID number for Metro

857 WA FREMANTLE SHACK MOTORS (Fremantle:- Shack & Kerr Holden Motors (1982) Pty Ltd, ) 1/01/1934 1/01/2011 64 Queen Victoria St, Fremantle, WA.6962Tel: 08 9432 9432
WA FREMANTLE SHACK MOTORS 59 Queen Street

I have dealers changing locations and number in the same street which is confusing.

GREEN IS CONFIRMED

Cheers
Balfizar

Edited by Balfizar, 31 January 2011 - 06:39 PM.

[Balfizar]

494 was beazley & bruce in canberra during the 70's. later taken over by john wright holden if my memory is correct.

GRUMPY 73.

My records show Beazley and Bruce with 3 locations in Canberra (Possible 4th )

???? Barton Brisbane Avenue
???? Belconnen Josephson St (Bought out by Gerald Slaven Dealer ID 875)
547 Braddon Mort street started 1985 (bough out Rolfe Holden Dealer ID 547)

I have John Wright Holden Dealer ID 46 at Belconnen now listed as a motor trader in 30/6/1989 as a mitsubishi dealer
I have Beazley and Bruce both Belconnen and Braddon listed as motor traders as at 30/6/1989

I have Beazley and Bruce Braddon as a franchise start date of 2/1/1985

494 could have been could have been B&B at Belconnen, I think unlikely but I have been wrong before and will be again
it goes with the job of sorting out this dealer list.

Cheers
Balfizar

[Balfizar]

494 BEAZLEY & BRUCE MAIN BRANCH
495 A.C.T. MOTORS
496 ESMONDS QUEANBEYAN

All 3 of the above were the main dealers in Canberra not in the outer suburbs. If you look at the quantity each of these dealer No's sold during lc & lj era in the late
60"s & 70's. I will bring the figures in to work tomorrow & post them up so you can see what i mean. Often a major dealer may have multiple outlets but only use
1 dealer code as all stock was controlled at head office to keep financial control in hand as a lot of dealers inventory in the yard was financed (g.m.a.c.)
e.g. motors ltd in Tasmania had 6 new car retail outlets but only 1 number.(129). freeman motors in s.a. only had 1 no (140) but had 4 outlets at one time
united motors in Adelaide (151) again 1 number but multiple outlets. Not ALL dealers operated this way eg Sutton's in nsw had multiple No's and so did Preston motors
in Victoria all ran separate No's for each outlet. more gristle for the mill.
GRUMPY 73.

Grumpy73,
I was suspicious about single or multiple dealers Id's thanks for confirming the variations. What adds confusion to the plot and not that it needs any more, is that dealers e.g. Beazley and Bruce had multiple owners and multiple sites and still traded as Beasley & Bruce when owned by another Holden dealer. So if what you say is true about multiple sites under one head office Dealer Id (and I don't dispute its true , it makes sense) B&B would have adopted the new owners Id or been issued / re-issued a new ID. They obviously could not run under the old ID.

It would seem the a dealer ID list is a moving target even over the Torana period or any period. The only way to nail the dealer ID list is to list all variants. Then you could drill down to your delivery dealer by manufactured / delivery / Vin data(date)

More research is required!! It seems obvious that GMH re-issued ID's how else could 494 get from the defunct Beazley and Bruce up to Mc Grath Sutherland.

Cheers
Balfizar

Edited by Balfizar, 01 February 2011 - 03:39 PM.

[Balfizar]

Now that Grumpy has clued me up a bit, I still reserve the right to be confused occasionally if not mostly.

Verified
128 TAS HOBART MOTORS P/L RENTAL (DP- Vincent Kean) 179 Macquarie Street 7000

[Balfizar]

And while I am at it lets not forget Beazley and Bruce (YASS) trading as Bill Nesbitt Holden.
so dealer Id's could drift across state boarders.

The dealer ID's seem to be sequenced / tied to a distribution centre rather than a state. e.g. northern NSW is tied to QLD / Brisbane
756 NSW BALLINA Quayside Holden Ballina (Ballina Holden :- zoned in QLD)
Cnr Pacific Highway & Ronan Place, Ballina, 2478 02 6618 1700

A rather liberal approximation of state based numbers would put QLD in the 700's / 800's / 900's



Cheers
Balfizar

Edited by Balfizar, 02 February 2011 - 12:09 AM.

[Balfizar]

[quote name='GRUMPY 73' timestamp='1296625835' post='568636']
Hello , as promised some figures for you to ponder are as follows.Dealer 494 Beazley & Bruce sold 388 LC toranas & 499 LJ toranas.
Dealer 495 A.C.T. motors sold 313 LC toranas & 271 LJ torana's.Dealer 496 Esmond's motors sold 472 LC toranas & 566 LJ torana's
Remember torana sales may only have been worth 1 in 4 new car sales in a dealership against all the other models in the holden range
at the time. this may give you a bit of an idicator of the volume flow of vehicles going through some dealers.

GRUMPY 73

Grumpy73
Thanks for that, I see what you mean . Impressive numbers when you thing of the period and size of Canberra at the time.
Cheers
Balfizar

[Balfizar]

JOHN WRIGHT ran in the early 80's to late 85 prior to gerald slaven taking over at josephson street also Bob Masling was the dealer in Yass during the early to mid
70's before bill nesbitt
GRUMPY 73

Grumpy,
You sure do have the info! Esmond's(1940) of 38 Mort street Braddon some how and I think there were a few permutations along the way, turned into John Wright 38 Mort Street Braddon and eventually Gerald Slaven.
Esmonds traded as Beazley and Bruce (1953) and also owned Capitol motors. I cannot work out if Beazley and Bruce was just a trading name for Esmond's (likely) and therefore Esmonds owner Bill Nesbitt:-Yass.

Esmond's / Beazley and Bruce / wright / Rolfe / Slaven multiple locations and a pretty tangled mess. If you have a car from a multi dealership / single dealer ID and you are trying to trace it back to the delivering dealer you going to have hard time working out which one!!!

Thanks for the info
Cheers
Balfizar

Edited by Balfizar, 03 February 2011 - 09:10 PM.

[Bazza]

JOHN WRIGHT ran in the early 80's to late 85 prior to gerald slaven taking over at josephson street also Bob Masling was the dealer in Yass during the early to mid
70's before bill nesbitt
GRUMPY 73

Hi Grumpy73

I have Bob Masling Motors in Yass at least as far back as 1964. Where does F I Kelly fit into the mix for Yass?

Cheers

Bazza

Edited by Bazza, 03 February 2011 - 09:20 PM.

[Balfizar]

JOHN WRIGHT ran in the early 80's to late 85 prior to gerald slaven taking over at josephson street also Bob Masling was the dealer in Yass during the early to mid
70's before bill nesbitt
GRUMPY 73

Grumpy,
You sure do have the info! Esmond's(1940) of 38 Mort street Braddon some how and I think there were a few permutations along the way, turned into John Wright 38 Mort Street Braddon and eventually Gerald Slaven.
Esmonds traded as Beazley and Bruce (1953) and also owned Capitol motors. I cannot work out if Beazley and Bruce was just a trading name for Esmond's (likely) and therefore Esmonds owner Bill Nesbitt:-Yass.

Esmond's / Beazley and Bruce / wright / Rolfe / Slaven multiple locations and a pretty tangled mess. If you have a car from a multi dealership / single dealer ID and you are trying to trace it back to the delivering dealer you going to have hard time working out which one!!!

Thanks for the info
Cheers
Balfizar

More research reveals,
Beazley and Bruce were a plaster board manufacturer in Queenbeyan 1929. It is speculation that they bought Esmond's their local garage and it snowballed from there.
ESMOND'S GARAGES New Company Registered SYDNEY, Monday. 14/5/1929
The following company was, register ed in Sydney today: Esmond's Garages Ltd., nominal capital �30,000, in 20,000 ordinary shnres and 10,000 preference shares of �1 each, to carry on as manufacturers, engineers, and as agents for motor cars, cycles, and air-craft.
The directors aro Messrs. J. Esmond, A. McDonald, and J. Simmie. The head office is at Queanbeyan. GMH distributor 1/7/1953

ESMONDS MOTORS PTY. LIMITED, QUEANBEYAN

Trading in Canberra as
Beazley & Bruce Pty. Ltd.
ANNOUNCE THEIR OPENING TRADING DATE AS
WEDNESDAY, 16th SEPTEMBER 1953
at 8 a.m.
From these Premises Beasley & Bruce Pty. Limited will control the Distribution and Servicing of HOLDEN Sedans and Utilities and CHEVROLET Commercial Units. Complete Servicing Facilities are available and Competent Staff will ensure
Your Complete Satisfaction. N.R.M.A. Service in the Form of: . Free Roadside Service to All Members . Free Touring Information
. N.R.M.A. Insurance (Renewals, Comprehensive Covers and 3rd Party Detail)
Will also be extended from these Modern and Up-to-date Motoring Facilities Premises at Canberra.
Beazley & Bruce Pty. Ltd.
General Motors Dealers and N.R.M.A. Depot,
44 MORT STREET, BRADDON, CANBERRA
CANBERRA PHONES: J 1888 and J 1889

Beazley and Bruce were a plaster board manufactures in crawford street queenbeyan 23/8/1929

James Frederick Beazley and George Hamilton Bruce(trading as Beazley and Bruce)

BEAZLEY & BRUCE, QUEANBEYAN Distributors of Caltex Petroleum 29/11/1945

Dealer ID State Suburb Dealer Name < at least at least > ADDRESSPOST CODEPHONE
495 ACT BRADDON A. C. T. MOTORS Pty Ltd5 Lonsdale Street (Braddon)
494 ACT BELCONNEN BEAZLEY & BRUCE HOLDEN (BELCONNEN:-Sold to Gerald Slaven)1/01/1998 2 Josephson St 2617(02) 6222 2400
494 ACT BARTON BEAZLEY & BRUCE HOLDEN (BARTON Service Station)21/10/1954 Brisbane Avenue
547 ACT BRADDON BEAZLEY & BRUCE HOLDEN (BRADDON ACT:- 2/1/85)16/09/19531/07/1995 44 Mort Street BRADDON ACT 2612
ACT MANUKA CAPITOL MOTORS (Manuka) sub branch of ESMONDS motors)
495 ACT Phillip Commonwealth Motors - Phillip ACT8/05/19781/01/2011158 Melrose Dr 2606(02) 6121 2800
ACT KINGSTON COMMONWEALTH MOTORS (Kingston) Canberra Avenue Kingston
496 ACT BRADDONEsmonds Motors Canberra Limited (Canberra ACT)14/05/1929 38 Mort Street Braddon
496 ACT BRADDONEsmonds Motors Canberra Limited (T/as Beazley and Bruce)30/09/1954 44 Mort Street Braddon
875 ACT BELCONNEN Gerald Slaven Holden (Belconnen 1986 WAS Beazley & Bruce)2/04/19861/01/2011 2 Josephson St 2617(02) 6222 2400
46 ACT BRADDON JOHN WRIGHT HOLDEN (Braddon) before 1989 canberra Mitsubishi1/12/1983 38 Mort Street Braddon
ACT PHILLIPLES EATON HOLDENMelrose DriveACTBELCONNENMELLIS MOTORS Pty Ltd
547 ACT BRADDON Rolfe Holden (Braddon:- took over BEAZLEY AND BRUCE closed 28-2-2006)28/02/2006 44 Mort Street BRADDON ACT
2612p: (02) 6248 7888

NSW YASS BEAZLEY AND BRUCE Pty Ltd (T/as Bill Nesbitt Holden) 221 COMUR COURT. NSW 2582 YASS.

577 NSW YASS BILL NESBITT HOLDEN (Yass owned by Beazley & Bruce) 8/05/19751/07/1995 221 COMUR COURT. NSW 2582 YASS. 2582Tel.: +61(2) 6226 1866

Cheers
Balfizar

[GTR469]

Is this the dealer sticker for H C Dustings of Burwood Victoria or are the a couple of different ones

http://cgi.ebay.com....=item5aded678db