893 replies to this topic

[Bazza]

Another busted through EBay, Dealer listed and Vin checked against listing
446 Peter Robertson Motors, Vic. rgds Mark.T

Hi

I already have that on my personal list, but according to the LJ Owners Manual it is Peter Robinson (not Robertson) Motors, Main St, Lilydale Vic

I forgot to advise gtrtorana.

Bazza

[Dangerous]

In need of 617 Dealer as we have a few cars from this one so I`d say it must of been a popular car sales

Smiley, it might be Pat Cullen's garage, Liverpool. Can't confirm though.

Not popular for A9X's though - only a couple sold from there.

[Bazza]

Hi

Thanks to the link below - Pat Cullen Motors - Liverpool NSW is dealer 025

Bazza


http://www.gmh-toran...=0

[meanmachine72]

bazza were does it say that pat cullen is 025????
i have 617 as Pat Cullens Garage 324 to 360
hume highway liverpool..look in the back of your
dealership hand book!!!! cullens is 617 not 025
john

[Bazza]

Hi meanmachine72

No need to bit my head off.

The blurb on the Shannon's site describes the car as 82911JH236615 and explains that it was sold through Pat Cullen of Liverpool. The VIN disc says that the selling dealer of the car in question was 025. I, not unreasonably, concluded that 025 = Pat Cullen of Liverpool.

On what info are you basing your assertion that Pat Cullen is 617? My LJ owner's manual doesn't say Pat Cullen is 617 (or anything else for that matter).

I note that it is not on the list compiled by gtrtorana.

Cheers

Bazza

[Dangerous]

Just an observation, but if 616 is AC McGrath at Liverpool NSW, and 618 is LW Vagg at Pennant Hills, then numerically, 617 'fits' if it's Pat Cullen's at Liverpool. Actually, it does alphabetically too, if you look at numbers by state then alphabetically by suburb - there are glimmers of a pattern there. This is not the reason why I suspect that 617 is Pat Cullen's, but a separate observation.

Low end dealer numbers look to be an interesting bunch.

[Bazza]

Hi

I have no idea who dealer 617 is/was. I only mentioned 025 because that is what the VIN disc says. Yes, we know that dealers sometimes got vehicles from other dealers unbeknown to GMH, but we have to say that on the balance of probabilities, the VIN disc is correct in respect of the dealer that sold the vehicle. If we don't default to the VIN disc, no-one would ever know the original seller of the car unless they were in possession of the original paperwork.

Having said all that - does it really matter?

Bazza

[Dangerous]

Having said all that - does it really matter?

Bazza

To me - not really, except I'd like to at least find out a little more about one of my cars which apears to be quite a mystery. I can't find any records anywhere about it ever being registered, but I'm sure it was road driven at some stage. It came from 617.

I'd have to say that I'm a little surprised by how active this thread is though - it seems a lot of people are very interested in finding out where their car came from.

Cheers,

Dangerous

[Dr Terry]

Just an observation, but if 616 is AC McGrath at Liverpool NSW, and 618 is LW Vagg at Pennant Hills, then numerically, 617 'fits' if it's Pat Cullen's at Liverpool. Actually, it does alphabetically too, if you look at numbers by state then alphabetically by suburb - there are glimmers of a pattern there. This is not the reason why I suspect that 617 is Pat Cullen's, but a separate observation.

Low end dealer numbers look to be an interesting bunch.

Hi Guys.

I don't think that the number sequence was always based on geographic location. It may have been in 1948 when the numbers were first issued, but after that date, each number was issued as required.

For example, Pat Cullen was a dealer in 1948 when the FX was first sold, so his dealer number would be quite low like Suttons Homebush, could even be 025.

Les Vagg however didn't even start business until around 1970, so his number will be higher, the 618 is about correct. The 616 for McGrath is a strange one though because they were trading in the 50s. Unless they moved premises & were issued with a new number.

The numbers are very random, sometimes when a new owner took over an existing dealership the number remained the same. On other occassions they were with issued a new number. Probably depends on who was in charge at the time.

At their peak Holden had well over 600 dealers, it's now around 350-400, I wonder how many are original 1948 dealers with their original number.

Dr Terry.

[Bazza]

Hi

As a matter of interest (according to my  LJ Owner Manual)

In Jan 1972 there were 521 GMH dealers in Aust.

172              NSW
121                Vic
89                Qld
62                  SA
61                  WA
12                  Tas
  3                  NT
  1                  ACT

                 
As at Dec 2005 - there were only 288

Bazza

Hi

There are some examples of 025 and 617 on the same page - so it is doubtful that they are one and the same. Probably the car in question changed hands between dealers.

Bazza

[meanmachine72]

Hi meanmachine72

No need to bit my head off.

The blurb on the Shannon's site describes the car as 82911JH236615 and explains that it was sold through Pat Cullen of Liverpool.

bazza if you were to meet me you would then know i have no chance of biting your head off what was wrong with my post to you????i wont say sorry for i nothing to be sorry for...I can understand why the "other dealer list" being complied will never grace this forum.. which is a pity..can you imagine this
dealer 616 and dealer 617 both are trading at liverpool in the 70s..back then liverpool and surrounding areas were full of market gardens and 2 huge holden dealerships..A.C. mcgrath (616) located at the corner of the Hume highway and boundary rd Liverpool..A.C. Mcgrath are still trading on the same site today,
Pat Cullens garage (617) located at 324 to360 Hume Highway Liverpool and traded up till early 1991..In 1991 A.C. Mcgrath(616) then bought Pat Cullens Garage(617) for a undisclosed sum That merging created the Mcgrath Motor group that now stands over both sites...Mcgraths new dealer number is 544..Pat Cullen is now dead but he wanted his son Peter to take over the business,But when Peter turned his back on the offer Pat sold to Mcgraths, I gleened all this info out of a Gentlemen called Sam Ferraro who still works at Mcgraths today,Sam also worked for both A.C.Mcgraths (616) and Pat Cullens (617) and he also worked at Ron Hodgsons Holden Cabramatta(036)..In 70s/80s Sam reports that Hodgsons was the biggest Holden Dealership in N.S.W.But they went bust and Sam moved to Pat Cullens (617) Sam then went to A.C.Mcgaths (616) and was there when A.C.Mcgraths Bought out Pat Cullen(617)..This is Sam Ferraro:s entire working Life and he is still selling holdens and making a living at McGraths at Liverpool(544)!!!! The "blurb" on the shannons site is wrong and (025) is someone other than Pat Cullens Garage(617) as the Mcgrath Motor group was very helpfull to me when i started to talk about tracking motor history down .. They put me in touch with Sam Ferraro who in turn has put up with me asking all these questions and i have no doubt about what Sam has informed to me..I have his number for any doughters and I may yet get some pics of both the old yards... "That would be
Cool"
Cheers johno

[Bazza]

Hi meanmachine72

Johno, I have no idea why you are labouring the point about this issue but I can see you are very passionate about it. All I said was that the Shannon's ad gave a VIN and the VIN disc said "dealer 025". I gave an oft quoted scenario as to how this is known to have happened in the past.

It is a matter of supreme indifference to me who is, or was, 025 or 617.

What part of the Shannon's ad is wrong? The ad didn't say the dealer was 025 - the ad said it was Pat Cullen.

I don't recall asking for an apology, I don't need one and have nothing else to say about the matter other than to reflect that your initial response came across as a little strident. Haven't we covered most of this the by PM?

Cheers

Bazza

Edited by Bazza, 22 September 2007 - 02:21 PM.

[meanmachine72]

BAZZA....What part dont you understand?????
re..read my post.....

[Bazza]

BAZZA....What part dont you understand?????....  

Well to be quite honest - none of it. Perhaps I should say that I understand what you are saying, but not your point. It matters little however, because I have further interest.

Bazza

[meanmachine72]

BAZZA....What part dont you understand?????.... �

Well to be quite honest - none of it. Perhaps I should say that I understand what you are saying, but not your point. It matters little however, because I have further interest.

Bazza

well your the one that comes across as strident Bazza...you said to me "why was 617 a sercret"..it is not.. i have told you how i come across my imformation and you say to me that you dont understand the information that i shared with you!!!!! open your eyes MAN!!!!My point is that 617 is Pat Cullens Garage not 025 as you would like to see it as..i have spent a lot of time ringing and talking to people about this matter and i have even talked to a guy that even sold cars at dealer 617 and he tells me that 617 was PAT CULLENS GARAGE that good enough for me!!! and that info came straight from Sams mouth...do you want Sams phone number bazza????..then you can check for your self,but then if you have no futher interest you are closing your mind to whats right and not open to debate,sure the shannons advert was slick but they do that to generate interest in the car,i have no problem with the vin and dealer number, but they are wrong in using Pat Cullens name..shannons just like this forum dont know who dealer 025 is.......Yet!!
cheers johno

P.S. bazza.. my car comes from there

[Bazza]

BAZZA....What part dont you understand?????....  

Well to be quite honest - none of it. Perhaps I should say that I understand what you are saying, but not your point. It matters little however, because I have no further interest.

Bazza

Johnno

What part of the above don't YOU understand? I just don't care - all I did was quote Shannon's ad. If Shannon's have used Pat Cullen's name in vain - take it up with them - not me.
I
just
don't
care.

I won't be responding further because I don't want a "warn" from the mods and I am sure that everyone is bored to tears by now.

Bazza

[dpz]

Hi Guys...

According to the GMH Vin list, my LC GTR went to dealer 865.
The original owner protection plan states it was bought from

A.C.T Motors PTY LTD
3 Lonsdale St. Braddon A.C.T

No longer around I believe!

[toranasaurus]

hey guys
i have 8/70 LC XU1 with dealer 45 from the listing and the dealer sticker on the back window says Ron Hodgson motors but doesnt say what suburb it was(am thinking Sydney somewhere) .hope this helps.

[rodomo]

I dont see Dillon's of Ivanhoe on the list?
My brother in law bought a LC XU-1 (second hand) off them in the early 70's
He worked there as an apprentice.

[rodomo]

I dont see Dillon's of Ivanhoe on the list

If we had the correct dealer number for Dillon's, we could place it on list. You say your brother in law worked there so he may know it's dealer number.

I asked and he doesn't know, it was about 35yrs ago.

[gtrboyy]

000 Internal Holden code (race cars etc)

My lc gtr had that code according to the info I was sent by hg350,as far as I know it was just a plain 11/69 monza blue gtr.Did all the first batch of lc gtr's have that code?

[Bazza]

000 Internal Holden code (race cars etc)

My lc gtr had that code according to the info I was sent by hg350,as far as I know it was just a plain 11/69 monza blue gtr.Did all the first batch of lc gtr's have that code?

Hi

No, on the contrary, 000 codes are the exception rather than the rule. I have checked the first few months of each assembly plant.

Bazza