278 replies to this topic

[76lxhatch]

You need to reduce the diameter of the disc in order to make it fit with Torana stubs, the caliper sits closer to the axle. Whether you need to grind the calipers depends on which ones you choose (and which tie rod ends to a lesser extent).

[v6 torana]

I have read a heap of threads on the forum regarding fitting HQ-HZ Brakes/Stub axles onto Torana's.

 

My question regards an LC Torana fitted with HZ stubs, brakes, steering arms.

 

The problem: The steering rack arms are on quite an angle when connected by tie rod end to steering arms. Will UC Torana steering arms solve this issue or do i need to spend some coin on reproduced a9x steering arms ?

 

Thanks

 

Peter

[Toranamat69]

I am not sure anyone has actually done any bumpsteer measurements on and LC with HZ stubs and the various steering arm options.  For sure the original LC ones are not correct though.

 

It is hard to compare the LC ones with the LX, UC or A9X steering arms as the LCs have the tie rod go in from the bottom, whereas the others all go in from the top.

 

I would suggest as a simple comparison, you could fit up the original LC setup and take a photo, or measurements of the angle of the tie rod and then swap over to HZ stubs and do a comparison using the different steering arm options. 

 

My gut feel is the A9X would be too low and either the LX or UC would be closest to what you would want but you really would need do a proper bumpsteer measurement to be sure of the best to use. You may find that none of them are close to optimum

[v6 torana]

I am not sure anyone has actually done any bumpsteer measurements on and LC with HZ stubs and the various steering arm options.  For sure the original LC ones are not correct though.

 

It is hard to compare the LC ones with the LX, UC or A9X steering arms as the LCs have the tie rod go in from the bottom, whereas the others all go in from the top.

 

I would suggest as a simple comparison, you could fit up the original LC setup and take a photo, or measurements of the angle of the tie rod and then swap over to HZ stubs and do a comparison using the different steering arm options. 

 

My gut feel is the A9X would be too low and either the LX or UC would be closest to what you would want but you really would need do a proper bumpsteer measurement to be sure of the best to use. You may find that none of them are close to optimum

I am assuming it is fitted with HZ steering arms however since the tie rod ends are fitted from the bottom side could they be LC Torana steering arms ?

[Toranamat69]

LC arms are very short with the tie rod from the bottom, HQ to HZ power steering ones are longer and the HQ to HZ manual steer are longer again.

 

If you have the HQ ones on there, I doubt you will get full lock and it will affect the ackerman of your steering which was never great on LCs anyway but either way, I highly doubt they will be correct for bumpsteer on an LC.

[UCSLE]

You should be able to use Hq stubs with lc steering arms ? Since the the tie rod bolts from the bottom you can just use bump steer correction tie rods. 

[v6 torana]

Thanks for the info guys, i might take a picture of the steering arms that are (currenty fitted) and post on forum for ID.

[gtrboyy]

Cool.Interested to see the differences.Started to slowly play around with this type of thing untill work situation took away all my time & then car failed/fallout with engineer over mods.Didn't like the angles & bumpsteer was tad noticable.

 

Never got conclusive opinion if harrop arms would fix it with hq stubs.

Steering set up looked better with torrie stubs but for some reason brake caliper clearance was not good so revertedr back to the custom big brake with hq stubs setup I'd had on car for awhile.

[v6 torana]

 

You should be able to use Hq stubs with lc steering arms ? Since the the tie rod bolts from the bottom you can just use bump steer correction tie rods.

 
Good idea UCSLE with the bump steer correction tie rods, I havent seen them fitted on an LC.

Here are a few pictures (low res) of the steering arms. Does anyone know what they are off ??

 Pic_1113_004.jpg   16.66K   10 downloads
 Pic_1113_003.jpg   15.64K   10 downloads
 Pic_1113_009.jpg   14.55K   9 downloads

[76lxhatch]

HQ-WB power (and HQ only manual) steer by the looks

[v6 torana]

HQ-WB power (and HQ only manual) steer by the looks

 

Will a "UC" steering arm fit a HQ-WB stub axle ? If they do what is the approx measurement from tie rod hole to first mounting bolt on "UC" steering arm ? (currently 10cm as per pictures above)

[gtrboyy]

Pretty sure they all bolt up..someone on here did the comparisons with pics for an lh torrie that had lh,uc & harrop arms.Might have been Rory.

 

I just remember lc arms/stubs tierod/steering arms looked straight where as with hq etc had fair degree of angle which I didn't like not helped by the hq stubs.

[Toranamat69]

Yeah all steering arms will actually bolt to all Holden stub axles from LC, to UC and HQ to WB, I am pretty sure even the HR and HT share the same bolt spacing for steering arms but their arms are bent differently being for rear steer.

 

As best as I can measure with the big offset on the Torana steering arms, the LH/LX ones are about 70mm and the UC ones about 75mm.

 

I can get the LC measurement too if you need them, I just need to dig a few panels out of the way to get to my spare disc front end and I also have some short HQ arms here somewhere.

 

I will be in the shed chasing spiders later.  Geez there are some big ones round here at the moment too.  I just about shook hands with a massive huntsman on the garage door knob last night - scared the crap out of me.

[v6 torana]

Thanks for the info guys, dont worry about the measurement Toranamat69 (huntsman spiders are creepy). I have found a set of UC steering arms from old mate in QLD for $25 each + postage to NSW.

 

Once i fit the UC steering arms I will add another post and let you know how it finished up.

[royalplumss]

After hours and hours of reading and asking questions from some of the more notably experienced members on here, I decided to install a simple Torana/HQ combination that was easily sourced without any expensive mods (except for the Harrop arms).

HQ stubs

HQ calipers (PBR Steel - smaller ones)

HQ discs

UC upper control arms - fitted to redrilled lower point on UC Kframe

LX lower control arms (didnt have thicker LH on hand)

Harrop steering arms

 

All in all - I am pretty happy with how it all went together, but am yet to test it on the road - and wont be able to for some time (it has been 16 years so far)

 

For those that would like to see the combo as fitted

 

 

Attached Files

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•  gmh1.JPG   66.04K   17 downloads

[royalplumss]

yep i have the same set up on my lx with the harrop arms.big difference.but for the money ive spent.....i wish id have stuck with torana stubbs and machined down hq discs.using standard,matching  torana steering arms and uc top control arms....steering geometry stays the same ,and youll save a bucketload of cash.so if you decide to throw money away using hq stubbs and forking out over 300 clams for harrop gear that wont make your old car steer like your new one ...more the fool you...

 

The intention of using converted HQ components with the other mods is to replicate the superior A9X set-up - not keep the flawed LX setup.

The first rule I was taught for spirited driving is to ensure you have enough brakes (even though HQ are far from the best brakes actually available in this modern era) 

Nothing is more helpful than when you can walk into Repco/ Supercheap/ etc and get a disc or two over the counter - for those occasions when you are nowhere near home

The second was to ensure the car steered properly. Since the car will often see dirt at the edges of some pretty long drops and some pretty big trees, it is somewhat important.........

 

It is the KISS principle

 

As said - a 'big difference'. To stop and steer properly with easily replaced components is well worth the investment with Mr Ron to get the last bit right.

For those that would tempt Murphy - more fool you

 

Having said that, I think the machined down HQ disc combo would be a fine trade-off for a weekend warrior or a car that doesnt stray too far from home - or driven too hard.

Just not a trade-off I would take for mine.

[TerrA LX]

After hours and hours of reading and asking questions from some of the more notably experienced members on here, I decided to install a simple Torana/HQ combination that was easily sourced without any expensive mods (except for the Harrop arms).
HQ stubs
HQ calipers (PBR Steel - smaller ones)
HQ discs
UC upper control arms - fitted to redrilled lower point on UC Kframe
LX lower control arms (didnt have thicker LH on hand)
Harrop steering arms
 
All in all - I am pretty happy with how it all went together, but am yet to test it on the road - and wont be able to for some time (it has been 16 years so far)
 
For those that would like to see the combo as fitted

It all sounds good (And I mean that) but have you checked lock to lock through out the suspension/steering range to ensure your steering stops contact BEFORE anything else?

Edited by TerrA LX, 26 November 2013 - 01:19 PM.

[rexy]

I think people tend to get a bit carried away at times.
Personally as my time is my own to work on the cars I am happy to do things in a stepwise fashion and see how they turn out. Never been a fan of spending money for things I may not need.
On the hatch I went from the standard set up to one tonner stubs and discs, kept the alloy LX calipers bodies and added the HX pad carriers. Total cost zero as parts already stockpiled in shed. I already ran commodore rear discs.
Drives just fine for my needs and I won't be changing to the Harrop steering arms.

[royalplumss]

It all sounds good (And I mean that) but have you checked lock to lock through out the suspension/steering range to ensure your steering stops contact BEFORE anything else?

 

Hi Red

It doesnt hit anything lock to lock at the moment - but it is still up off the ground.

I am happy to engineer suitable stops if necessary - as I am going to fit 8x14s (which are the same ones that were on it with standard LX

I have also omitted the A9X subframe bumpstop in the hope that the wheels will not contact the rest of the body when loaded (yet to be seen)

Having spoken to various people on here, there is a reasonable chance that with the full length HD springs it will be OK

With 7 inch rubber, I wouldnt have had any concerns

 

I suppose it is a little too early to be sure yet