Neither of you guys have seen footage of a reaward looking view of the wheel of a race car on slicks have you?..Find that and tell me you dont need a panhard then...your whole diff assembly moves in and out about 1.5"...thats 40/50mm.
R
Panhard V No panhard rod.
Started by
rodomo
, Dec 30 2007 09:25 AM
206 replies to this topic
#152
_brett_32i_
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Posted 06 March 2009 - 08:55 AM
scrap what the general put in there and switch to irs. its not that hard...
#153
_Squarepants_
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Posted 06 March 2009 - 05:46 PM
Neither of you guys have seen footage of a reaward looking view of the wheel of a race car on slicks have you?..Find that and tell me you dont need a panhard then...your whole diff assembly moves in and out about 1.5"...thats 40/50mm.
R
Mine is a street car, I don't run slicks, and who knows what sort of setup (ie. bushes and trailing arms) that car is using.
By the way, 1.5" is 38.1mm.
And when you say "need", who says I don't like the way my diff moves anyway? If I wanted a car that gripped and handled like a Ferrari, I'd buy a Ferrari.
The fact remains that an ill fitted panhard creates as many problems as it solves. If anyone sorts it out properly so it doesn't create more drama's, more power to them. All I'm saying is I don't know enough about them (or drive my car "fast" enough) to make it worth my while.
Plus, it makes my fishtales seem wider!
Brett, got any more info/pics on the IRS idea?
#154
_rorym_
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Posted 06 March 2009 - 06:23 PM
Mine is a street car, I don't run slicks,
You don't have to...horsepower creates it..but then..its your choice..pick a tree...any tree.
Good luck.
R
#155
Posted 06 March 2009 - 10:12 PM
According to the tyre rub marks in the guards I get up to 20mm movement in my street car. I have a watts link stashed away to suit the diff but very little hope of ever making it fit
#156
_rorym_
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Posted 06 March 2009 - 10:36 PM
Listen to this man..he has knowledge...^^^
Mate fit the Ford hat and attach the Wats from there..You are running the B/W 78?..Yes?
R
Mate fit the Ford hat and attach the Wats from there..You are running the B/W 78?..Yes?
R
#157
WhiteA9XS
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Posted 06 March 2009 - 11:11 PM
all us group c torana guys dont run a panhard bar , w,eve tried them and taken them back off , even brocky ordered it off at philip island 06 in an a9x .
the torana rear end will bind because of the arc it travels in , a watts linkage is the only way to go if you want to go panhard but thats out of the question for us .
use quality good rubber bushes to minimize the movement , pedders part number 5820 by memory
the torana rear end will bind because of the arc it travels in , a watts linkage is the only way to go if you want to go panhard but thats out of the question for us .
use quality good rubber bushes to minimize the movement , pedders part number 5820 by memory
#158
ls2lxhatch
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Posted 06 March 2009 - 11:46 PM
According to the tyre rub marks in the guards I get up to 20mm movement in my street car. I have a watts link stashed away to suit the diff but very little hope of ever making it fit
Body roll will also contribute to tyre rub. The tyre would only need to be leaning over a few degrees in relation to the body to take up 20 mm of clearance. You can test the theory by jacking one wheel off the ground.
The panhard rod will force the diff to move left or right every time suspension moves, even in a straight line. Whether the diff movement is more or less than the diff movement experienced in a street car without a panhard rod will depend on driving style and the panhard rod design.
Edited by ls2lxhatch, 06 March 2009 - 11:47 PM.
#159
Posted 07 March 2009 - 06:14 AM
Rory yes I have the Ford diff hat for the Borg Warner but the floor pan isn't very accommodating. I'd love to do it one day but we'll see...
ls2lxhatch I realise tyre rub is a really bad way to measure it, but its definitely marked further outward than the roll will account for. Interestingly enough the worst roll and tyre rub is at very low speed driving in and out of steep driveways on an angle; I've managed to chop enough out now that this is about the only time it ever touches any more. Driving style most definitely has an influence at higher speeds!
ls2lxhatch I realise tyre rub is a really bad way to measure it, but its definitely marked further outward than the roll will account for. Interestingly enough the worst roll and tyre rub is at very low speed driving in and out of steep driveways on an angle; I've managed to chop enough out now that this is about the only time it ever touches any more. Driving style most definitely has an influence at higher speeds!
#160
_rorym_
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Posted 07 March 2009 - 04:49 PM
Exactly..Hence I made it perfectly straight to the axle and relieeved the arms to allow for movement..as suggested by Greg/82911...no binding experienced.will depend on driving style and the panhard rod design.
R
#161
_rorym_
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Posted 07 March 2009 - 04:50 PM
Rory yes I have the Ford diff hat for the Borg Warner but the floor pan isn't very accommodating. I'd love to do it one day but we'll see...
I had to bash up the spare wheel hump...and removed the tank.
R
#162
ls2lxhatch
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Posted 07 March 2009 - 07:59 PM
The panhard will still swing in an arc causing the diff to move.Exactly..Hence I made it perfectly straight to the axle and relieved the arms to allow for movement..as suggested by Greg/82911...no binding experienced.
R
#163
_rorym_
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Posted 07 March 2009 - 08:09 PM
If your spring movement is max 2" it will be bugger all.
R
R
#164
_Squarepants_
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Posted 07 March 2009 - 08:44 PM
I had to bash up the spare wheel hump...and removed the tank.
R
I'm still running a spare tyre in the stock position, and a standard fuel tank.
I'm more than happy with the way my car handles in my tree. Tyres don't rub at all, and I drive it pretty hard considering it's a street car.
This is what I was saying, it creates as many problems as it solves.
Good luck with your 50mm of suspension travel.
#165
_rorym_
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Posted 07 March 2009 - 09:21 PM
With my suspension thats all it moves.
R
R
#166
ls2lxhatch
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Posted 08 March 2009 - 01:29 AM
If you assume the panhard bar is 900 mm long and the suspension travel is 50 mm straight up and down then I calculate the total diff movement will be an insignificant 1.39 mm. At 100 mm of suspension travel the total movement will be 5.54 mm.
The calculation is based on entering the panhard bar length as side b, the suspension travel as side a and angle C as 90 degrees. The difference between side b and side c should be close to the theoretical diff movement. The calculation for movement during cornering is far more complicated due to body roll.
http://www.csgnetwor...ghttricalc.html
Rory, how long is your panhard bar?
The calculation is based on entering the panhard bar length as side b, the suspension travel as side a and angle C as 90 degrees. The difference between side b and side c should be close to the theoretical diff movement. The calculation for movement during cornering is far more complicated due to body roll.
http://www.csgnetwor...ghttricalc.html
Rory, how long is your panhard bar?
#167
rodomo
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Posted 08 March 2009 - 08:42 AM
I've been searching for a calculator like that. Thanks!!!!
#168
_rorym_
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Posted 13 March 2009 - 05:10 PM
LS2,
Will measure it when I get the car back from MRNOS.
R
Will measure it when I get the car back from MRNOS.
R
#169
_brett_32i_
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Posted 29 March 2009 - 03:23 PM
i still have the ford watts link fitted under mine and i have no clearance issues. even with a commodore fuel tank. this is in a uc by the way.
rory, are you in a class where you can only fit a panhard??
squarepants - pm your email
rory, are you in a class where you can only fit a panhard??
squarepants - pm your email
#170
Posted 29 March 2009 - 06:30 PM
Its not the fuel tank I'm worried about, its the floor pan, so maybe the UC pan is better? Do you have any pics?i still have the ford watts link fitted under mine and i have no clearance issues. even with a commodore fuel tank. this is in a uc by the way.
#172
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Posted 10 July 2009 - 01:54 PM
any updates??
What do you guys think for a street car with a bit of track on the odd weekends?
Urethane lowers (boxed)
Rubber Uppers (not boxed, maybe adjustable arms????)
Like said before, and a McDonald Bors Panhard kit????
So want more than just a street setup but the car isn't going to be a track only car either.
What do you guys think for a street car with a bit of track on the odd weekends?
Urethane lowers (boxed)
Rubber Uppers (not boxed, maybe adjustable arms????)
Like said before, and a McDonald Bors Panhard kit????
So want more than just a street setup but the car isn't going to be a track only car either.
#173
Evan
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Posted 10 July 2009 - 02:45 PM
I wanted a panhard bar , its they are hard to put in on a street car. you need to get a custom tank made or run a fuel cell. etc
I got a whiteline sway bar that bolted to the diff and then to the floor of the car.
I imagine that that would help stop the sideways movement. Not as effective as a panhard, but i noticed a big difference with it on.
looks similar to the 1 in this thread
http://www.gmh-toran...l=rear sway bar
Evan.
I got a whiteline sway bar that bolted to the diff and then to the floor of the car.
I imagine that that would help stop the sideways movement. Not as effective as a panhard, but i noticed a big difference with it on.
looks similar to the 1 in this thread
http://www.gmh-toran...l=rear sway bar
Evan.
#174
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Posted 10 July 2009 - 04:11 PM
Car will be on LPG with tank in boot so plenty of space no petrol tank, might even cut out the spare wheel well. Any other thought on the sway bar locating the diff somewhat????? or would it not be strong or mounted well engough to make much of a difference....
#175
_Squarepants_
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Posted 10 July 2009 - 04:39 PM
Too much flex from the link pin bushes. Only there to provide vertical support (reducing body roll).Any other thought on the sway bar locating the diff somewhat????? or would it not be strong or mounted well engough to make much of a difference....
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