Get a set of 308 roller rockers between you and makka. 1.6:1 ratio too
Build The Ultimate Starfire - Yes, Starfire
Started by
_BRN 084_
, Feb 13 2008 09:58 PM
92 replies to this topic
#51
Heath
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Posted 18 February 2008 - 06:02 PM
#52
_ezy_09s_
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Posted 18 February 2008 - 07:19 PM
18 degree chevy cylinder head cut down,roller cam,sheetmetal intake,efi with a F1 Procharger or nice size turbo.. should make 700 hp. 
#53
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Posted 18 February 2008 - 08:37 PM
throw the shit box in the bin and put something decent in it 
Edited by moot, 18 February 2008 - 08:37 PM.
#54
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Posted 18 February 2008 - 08:40 PM
^ Gotta love a bit of constructive advice.
Maybe talk to J-ZED about getting an Alloy head? I definitely think that EFI and PSI is the go...
Tim
Maybe talk to J-ZED about getting an Alloy head? I definitely think that EFI and PSI is the go...
Tim
#55
_Bomber Watson_
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Posted 18 February 2008 - 09:58 PM
Ok, my turn.
Buy a JZED head, but it down to fit. While your cutting convert it to DOHC. Get massive custom cams made for it, run 14:1 comp, get a turbo off a C 16 cummins and strap that to it with a custom sheet metal intake, custom exhaust and huge intercooler. Bore it out as far as you can go but keep the standard stroke. Wrap the whole kit and caboodle with 10x50mm flat bar, just cut straps, wrap them around the motor and weld them up, to keep it together. Five should do. Put a waste gate in the exhaust to limit boost at 45psi. Run it on Nitromethaine.
If you can get it to run long enough to get to a dyno should make good power...
*sorry datto i think i pissed a little to the side that time*
Cheers.
Buy a JZED head, but it down to fit. While your cutting convert it to DOHC. Get massive custom cams made for it, run 14:1 comp, get a turbo off a C 16 cummins and strap that to it with a custom sheet metal intake, custom exhaust and huge intercooler. Bore it out as far as you can go but keep the standard stroke. Wrap the whole kit and caboodle with 10x50mm flat bar, just cut straps, wrap them around the motor and weld them up, to keep it together. Five should do. Put a waste gate in the exhaust to limit boost at 45psi. Run it on Nitromethaine.
If you can get it to run long enough to get to a dyno should make good power...
*sorry datto i think i pissed a little to the side that time*
Cheers.
#56
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Posted 18 February 2008 - 10:03 PM
You're just living up to the statement in your sig.*sorry datto i think i pissed a little to the side that time*
Cheers.
#57
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Posted 18 February 2008 - 10:09 PM
Touche 
.
Knew i put that there for a reason.
Cheers.
. Knew i put that there for a reason.
Cheers.
#58
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Posted 19 February 2008 - 06:01 AM
why spend time and money on something,that is just crap to begin with?any jap engine of similar capacity will whip it and be 10 times cheaper.^ Gotta love a bit of constructive advice.
Maybe talk to J-ZED about getting an Alloy head? I definitely think that EFI and PSI is the go...
Tim
sometimes doing something different costs you shit loads of money with little results.
#59
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Posted 19 February 2008 - 10:26 PM
^^ Have to agree with moot..a decent late model engine ,ie: SR20 Turbo or similar would be the way to go..for power vs cost outlay.
At the end of the day you can make any bucket of shit engine perform with the appropriate mods..eg:(starfire).
But question comes back to 'Why bother'?..just to say its a Starfire engine that makes X amount of power??
When better performance could be achieved for about a tenth of the cost and much less headf*cks.
If you dont mind spending shitloads on a bucket of shit & modifiying every single component to get it to stay together & make power..then go for it.
At the end of the day you can make any bucket of shit engine perform with the appropriate mods..eg:(starfire).
But question comes back to 'Why bother'?..just to say its a Starfire engine that makes X amount of power??
When better performance could be achieved for about a tenth of the cost and much less headf*cks.
If you dont mind spending shitloads on a bucket of shit & modifiying every single component to get it to stay together & make power..then go for it.
#60
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Posted 20 February 2008 - 06:09 AM
heres a good case point,a mate of mine just built a v8 holden engine,with 8/71,big&ugly injector hat,alloy heads,roller cam,mag,and cam driven fuel pump etc. it sould make around 1600hp,and i promise that you've never seen a holden engine that looks like this..... but as he said to me,"if i did a chev based engine i could have made heaps more power for heaps less dollars"
#61
_BRN 084_
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Posted 22 February 2008 - 03:33 PM
Yeah, there is always going to be an easier option.
I was just keen to see if anyone had thought a Starfire through, and what could be done with one. I know a lot of people have taken the piss in this thread, but with different ideas there are always going to be some detractors.
Plus, I like the idea of keeping the HB looking 'old-school' and a Starfire would help me with that. I may well end up going Jap, but I'm going to investigate this further first. Besides, the car only weighs 800kg, so outright power isn't the be all and end all here. If I can get 150-200hp out of one of these things, I'll be very, very happy. I probably won't but hey, it's worth a try.
As an aside - has anyone got a Starfire taking up space they can donate to the fund?
I was just keen to see if anyone had thought a Starfire through, and what could be done with one. I know a lot of people have taken the piss in this thread, but with different ideas there are always going to be some detractors.
Plus, I like the idea of keeping the HB looking 'old-school' and a Starfire would help me with that. I may well end up going Jap, but I'm going to investigate this further first. Besides, the car only weighs 800kg, so outright power isn't the be all and end all here. If I can get 150-200hp out of one of these things, I'll be very, very happy. I probably won't but hey, it's worth a try.
As an aside - has anyone got a Starfire taking up space they can donate to the fund?
Edited by BRN 084, 22 February 2008 - 03:42 PM.
#62
rodomo
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Posted 22 February 2008 - 05:29 PM
If you are hunting one, they were also available in "X" model Toyota Coronas of the same era.
#63
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Posted 01 September 2008 - 01:46 PM
Could try fittin 6cyl holden valves to head,means a bit of milling work and seats that are able to reach into throat area that can be machined down and blended in,solid roller cam with apropiate lift (450th+) at valve, roller rockers, modified roller lifters from como, 60th over bore,1mil off the blok,2mil off the head,twin 40 dcoe webers,2.5in exhaust,decent header pipes with merge collector,was one gettin round my way,didnt have those mods but kept up to mild 253 and rev to 7.they are much loved to be hated piece of work that holden in all their wisdom ever put in a car but nevertheless made by holden if we like it or not,not many people even bothered with em but if a bit of originality is what your lookin for give it go.smaller valves yes,look at the size of em in a 202 compared to bore size then look at the ones holden put in the starfire compared to bore size,someone out there must have had go at one but might be hard to get em to admit it.
#64
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Posted 01 September 2008 - 03:33 PM
They're just a 173 with 2 cylinders missing so standard 173 pistons with a head shaved would be OK. 179 pistons are just 173+0.060" so they might be easier to get. Cut down EFI like plenty have suggested and away you go. Twin 42mm DCOE Webers on 2/3 of a blue 6 manifold?
But how about a Turbo Gemini/Rodeo Engine (or Piazza engine - same thing but turbo std)? The Rodeos were 1800cc I think and some of the Jackeroos may have been 2.0L in the same size block. Or a 13B Rotary out of a SeriesIV RX7? Or an Alloytec 3.6L 195kW from a VZ SV6?
But how about a Turbo Gemini/Rodeo Engine (or Piazza engine - same thing but turbo std)? The Rodeos were 1800cc I think and some of the Jackeroos may have been 2.0L in the same size block. Or a 13B Rotary out of a SeriesIV RX7? Or an Alloytec 3.6L 195kW from a VZ SV6?
#65
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Posted 02 September 2008 - 07:28 PM
Seen a 307 Chev in a HB Torana - mid mounted! (It was a sports sedan)
Seriously though, I reckon I'd go for a mildly ported 13B with a couple of webers - kinda old school enough to not look too out of place in a HB and more grunt than You'd ever get out of a starfire....
Seriously though, I reckon I'd go for a mildly ported 13B with a couple of webers - kinda old school enough to not look too out of place in a HB and more grunt than You'd ever get out of a starfire....
#66
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Posted 03 September 2008 - 02:43 PM
ok i have never seen a starfire head so i can only go off what everone else has said, so if they are in fact the front half or rear half of a blue 202 head then you should be able to bolt the vk manifold on it and just remove the two runners thay arn't needed, then put a flange on the front of the manifold which can then have a vn v6 TB bolted to it ..... once you've done that your sorted for a manifold and injectors .....
if this beast has a similar dizzy to a blue 202 then you should be able to modify it the same as the 202 dizzy which once done should then plug directly into a je camira wiring loom and ignition coil/module .... and if that all works then a delco from a camira will probably all but run the thing straight up .... obviously you'd need to tune it to suit the engines mods etc ....
if you can't get a je camira wiring loom then get a vn v6 one and modify it where needed....
weather you turbo or not it would work with it either way and the delco is a very reliable, cheap and great functioning ecu. plus if you do it this way you cut down on custom shit and therefore if you need a new coil you go to a shop and buy a camira one or the ecu is a stock one etc .....
i say go for it .... i'm of the opnion that nothing is impossible with the old motors, and i like proving the under dog can suprise people
(i use a 202 rather then a starfire but its the same thing) especially like you say 800kg car, even if you only got 100hp out of it that would still be a good amount of power.
if your serious about the delco efi i can help you with information on how i did it on a 202 .....
if this beast has a similar dizzy to a blue 202 then you should be able to modify it the same as the 202 dizzy which once done should then plug directly into a je camira wiring loom and ignition coil/module .... and if that all works then a delco from a camira will probably all but run the thing straight up .... obviously you'd need to tune it to suit the engines mods etc ....
if you can't get a je camira wiring loom then get a vn v6 one and modify it where needed....
weather you turbo or not it would work with it either way and the delco is a very reliable, cheap and great functioning ecu. plus if you do it this way you cut down on custom shit and therefore if you need a new coil you go to a shop and buy a camira one or the ecu is a stock one etc .....
i say go for it .... i'm of the opnion that nothing is impossible with the old motors, and i like proving the under dog can suprise people
(i use a 202 rather then a starfire but its the same thing) especially like you say 800kg car, even if you only got 100hp out of it that would still be a good amount of power.if your serious about the delco efi i can help you with information on how i did it on a 202 .....
Edited by Sammy, 03 September 2008 - 02:46 PM.
#67
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Posted 04 September 2008 - 08:18 AM
you wouldn't sleeve the block and then add a deck plate. you would add a deck plate and the sleeves would pass through both. you would run a longer rod which would add reliability. and use a ford head. the ohc only needs two holes (the front ones by memory) elongated. pre ohc needs them all done.
not sure how well you could cut 2 chambers off it and then seal up the water/oil passages though.
it woudnt be worth running a starfire head as the seats and guides would need to be spread apart more to allow for the necessary bigger valves, and that is just too much $$
not sure how well you could cut 2 chambers off it and then seal up the water/oil passages though.
it woudnt be worth running a starfire head as the seats and guides would need to be spread apart more to allow for the necessary bigger valves, and that is just too much $$
#68
enderwigginau
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Posted 04 September 2008 - 12:23 PM
Firstly, you're not likely to make 150-200hp, but what the hay.
With minor mods, all 186/202 bits should be able to be utilised, and you'll have two spare of everything incase you break something.
Sammy's suggestion sounds good.
A Strata 2A style kit would run it fine.
How about you find an engine, get some pics and we'll brainstorm more.
Grant..
With minor mods, all 186/202 bits should be able to be utilised, and you'll have two spare of everything incase you break something.
Sammy's suggestion sounds good.
A Strata 2A style kit would run it fine.
How about you find an engine, get some pics and we'll brainstorm more.
Grant..
#69
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Posted 04 August 2009 - 11:41 AM
I would love to know if this actually was done...
#70
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Posted 04 August 2009 - 01:29 PM
Just throw in an SR20VE, ill get you 280N/A hp out of it as a daily. 320 is you want it to be a weekender!
#71
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Posted 06 August 2009 - 07:18 PM
What you need to do is some serious modifieing to the rocker cover so that it will fit on an SR20DET .... Or even better make a plastic mould of the top of the motor and stick it over a 20b Rotory. Only people who arent deaf will know... sneaky
#72
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Posted 06 August 2009 - 08:07 PM
Get a set of 308 roller rockers between you and makka. 1.6:1 ratio too
i always thought 308 were 1.65. or is that Ford Windsor? cant remember both fit on holden 6 lol
#73
Posted 07 August 2009 - 08:23 AM
I understand the factory pressed Holden V8 ones are around 1.63, most aftermarket roller rockers are 1.65 ratio
#74
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Posted 07 August 2009 - 09:08 AM
is it old 221 rockers that are 1.7:1?
its one of the old ford I6 engines from memory.
its one of the old ford I6 engines from memory.
#75
Heath
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Posted 07 August 2009 - 09:14 AM
I'd love to know some standard rocker ratios!
Sorry about the mistake re. the factory 308 rockers. Misinformed obviously
Thanks for the correction
Sorry about the mistake re. the factory 308 rockers. Misinformed obviously
Thanks for the correction
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