146 replies to this topic

[Ruts]

Hi everyone, just want to let everyone know that I have a forum members car arriving on 8/8/08 so that I can cut his front and rear guards. It's an LH/LX four door and I will be posting all the pics on the site so that anyone can see how I do the job and hope that others will benefit.
Ruts

[mr5000]

look forward to it im half way through one side on mine

[Ruts]

The patient has arrived and is being prepared for surgery, pics soon.

[MRLXSS]

Good work Dr. Ruts!

[Neils LX]

Hi
Great idea, i am yet to fit flares and cut my guards so it will be very helpful
Chears Neil

[GML-31]

are we there yet? are we there yet??

[Ruts]

G'day all, first an apology for taking so long to get thing rolling, I work shift work and sometimes it slows thing down a bit in the shed. I'll just have to give up work I suppose.

Anyway this is the first instalment of many in regards to certain paint and panel issues and I hope that someone out there may be able to benefit with some of the knowledge that I have gained after 18 years in the paint and panel industry. As the title states this is an article on fitting flares and cutting front and rear guards on a LH/LX four door. Now I don't pretent to be the guru in regards to carrying out this procedure and I know that there will me many who may disagree with the way I do things and that's fine. Over the years I have seen many many different ways to do this. I have seen some very ordinary attempts that should never see the light of day and I have seen some that look amazing, just have a look at LITRE8's car, a very professional job. The idea of the this article is to give others an insight in what can be achieved with a little careful planning and a touch of elbow grease so that you may feel a bit confident in tackling this job yourself. It's not that hard and if your prepared to take the challenge then the finished product will be very satisfying. As I go through this process PLEASE, if anyone has a better idea and thinks that I may be doing things wrong myself then tell me, I will not be offended by what you have to say and maybe I can learn a few things from others as well. Please keep in mind that I ma doing this job on my days off and it may take a week or two to get through the whole procedure. So grab a drink and sit back and enjoy this first instalment.

First a little background on this car. It belongs to fellow forum member who is getting this car ready for plenty of street driving and a little bit of track work. As this is not my toy I will keep a few things to myself about the owner and what has been done to the car but in short it's an LH four door fitted with a 350 Chev, toploader and nine inch diff. The car has flares already fitted with guards cut but after closer inspection we found that most have to be redone to bring it up to scratch. I know the owner will be reading this but I don't apologise for expressing my anger in regards to the butchers who last worked on the bodywork.

To see the pictures more clearly click to view the full size.

Here's the car,

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As we all know if you want bigger wheels and tyres you need to fit a set of flares to keep things legal and under the protruding bodywork. But when flares are fitted you also need to cut some of the body work away so that when the car moves or you put heavier loads in or you turn the front wheels you have ample clearance.

The front of the car has been fitted with 15x8 wheels and on full lock the wheels rub on the inner floor.

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This is the front with the wheels removed. You can see the shiny bare steel where the wheels have rubbed.

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Whoever put the flares on this car previous should be drawn and quartered. The fitment is very second rate. Have a look at how far down the front flare sits at the rear, very untidy.

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The rears are not much better than the fronts. Have a look at the fit on the passengers rear.
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Here's the driver's size
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Anyway time to close this one so that it does not exceed the allowable whatever.

[Ruts]

Ok, so to make things a bit easier to work on I suggest you set the car up at comfortable height to that you don't have to bend to much. I have a bad sciatic nerve so I need to have the car up a bit for ease of working

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What I suggest is that when you put the cars on stands you place the stands under the suspension so that the car sits at ride height and this will help with working out how much you need cut away to give ample clearance. This way in regards to the front you can put the wheel back on and turn it full lock see what sort of clearance you do have.
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As this car had already had flares fitted when I got the car off the ground I removed the flares and discovered more dodgy work.
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Now we were toying on putting the larger A9X style flares on this car as on one side the wheel actually stuck out past the flare (L34 style) and this was leading us to believe that the rear end may be bent after doing some measurements I found that the rear end is fine and that the problem was in the flare itself.
Note the difference between the two sides,
Drivers
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Passenegers
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So I think we will stay with the L34 flares so what I did next and what I suggest when fiting new flares is firstly make sure that the all the doors and guards are on the car so that all the gaps can be set. I've seen people try and fit flares with the rear doors removed and when the door was refitted the flare on the door and quarter panel did not match up. So as stated fit the panels and make sure the gaps are even. At this point I am going to concentrate on the passengers rear as the there is much more work in the rears than the front. Just remember when you do the other side just mirror everything we've done here. So we have the rear door gaps set to an acceptable standard. Now what I suggest you do is fit the door flare first. I do this as everything follows from this point. Set the flare where it fits the best, at the bottom of the door and against the whee larch so that its a snug fit.

Here is the same flare fitted on the same door but in the correct position. Note how much cleaner the lines look.
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the old
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The top of this flare is set against the rear edge of the door. Remember, set the bottom edge of the flare against the bottom edge of the door and make sure the rear top of the flare is against the rear edge of the door. Once these edges are set then fitting the rear is fairly straight forward. Set the top of the rear flare in line with the one on the door and make sure the rear bottom edge of the rear flare is set in the correct position on the lower 1/4 panel.

Here is a picture of the door flare fitted at the top near the rear edge of the door.
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When I had the door flare in the correct position I tried to fit the rear section but found that the previous dodgy repairs would not allow the flare to sit snugly on the 1/4 panel so I had to make a quick cut to get rid of some of the old guard. Please note that this is only a quick fix and is not the final cut but you can see how much I actually removed. Remember to cover any openings with a sheet or cardboard so that sparks will not damage anything and always wear eye and ear protection.
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Once the old bent and bogged up section was removed I was able to set the 1/4 panel flare in place. This picture is the flare fitted from directly side on, note the clean gap we have between the two flares which match up with the existing door gap. Nothing better than have an even gap all the way down. Also note how much lower the flare now sits against the old markings. I now see that a few holes will need to welded up on the doors. Nothing a mig and $$$$$$$$ won't fix.
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When viewed from the front you can see the difference between the door and 1/4 panel flare in regards to how much one sticks out further than the other.
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I have marked with a texta where the 1/4 panel flare needs a bit taken off so that both match up. You can see that the flare is sitting on the cut 1/4 panel / inner guard.
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Take the 1/4 panel flare off and take to it with a hand file to the whatever depth you need to make the two flares meet. When trial fitting flares I suggest you fit them with self tappers and washers at this stage.
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When you have filled the flare trial fit it back on and see if you need to take more off or not. If all is good it should look something like this.

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Note the nice even gap all the way down the door
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Note the difference between the old and the new after only 2 hours work.

Old
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New
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In regards to cutting the guards I suggest a hand held grinder and a quality cutting disc. The discs I use cut like a hot knife through butter.
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That's all for now folks. If anyone has any questions to ask feel free to ask them. Remember there are no such things as silly questions.

Ruts.

[Ruts]

G'day Rookie, I know what your talking about and I will covering this problem at a later date. I don't suggest you only use sikerflex. You need to give the outer panel a bit of strength so you what I suggest is you put a few tacks with a mig welder holding the inner and outer toghether. When you have tacked the two in about half a dozen spots then using sikerflex is fine. If you have ever read articles on installing wheel tubs they only use sikerflex between the tub and the 1/4 panel but in this case you need to join the inner and outer together to give it strength to hold the flare or I believe it will cause the 1/4 panel to flex too much.
In regards to the flare sticking out you can add fibreglass to the flare to line them up. I know you don't want to paint anything or do as little as possible but you will need to paint if you done fibreglass work. I will be doing some glass work so stay tuned. Also as you will see I put small tabs of metal in behind the flares (just like an A9X) to help hold the flare in position. When I cut the 1/4 panel and door you will see very soon that I will have the same problem as you so watch and I'll show you how to overcome this.

Ruts

[racean69]

Top stuff be watching closely... i am also about to do this.


Ruts I don't like telling any professional how to go about something but mate get a gaurd on that grinder... specialy with them thin wheels.

[Ruts]

Point taken about the grinder guard.

[Ruts]

Well I've just had another very productive day in the shed so here is the next chapter in this epic story.

When we left you last time I had just reset the flares on the rear door and 1/4 panel to a point where I was happy with the fit. What I will concentrate on this time is the marking and cutting of the back door and rear inside dog leg. Before I start here are few pictures of some the doors I have in the shed that have been cut by myself and others before me.

This door is from my fathers original SLR5000, yeah I know about the colour but we painted it back in 1986 when Formula Blue from the VK grooup A was the in thing.

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The flares and inside of the doors were fitted and cut back in 1978 so I suppose this was how they cut the doors in the old days. Just like Yella's old girl there is not much taken off the door. This car was fitted with 265/50 14's hotwires and there was no problem with tyre rub.
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This door is from an SLR5000 fitted with large A9X flares which had 345/35 15 Pirelli's. This car had no problem with rear tyre rub but note the amount taken from the door.
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same door from the inside. Note the finish is a littel bit rough.
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This last set is from an L32 SLR which I am in the process of finishing so that I can sell this car. You can see the build of this car in 'Members projects and plans'
Passengers rear inside
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Passengers rear outside (unfinished)
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Drivers rear inside with flare fitted
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Same door
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I just wanted to show everyone the difference in each car. Now back to the point at hand.

Please note I always start with the door them work back. I believe the door flare dictates where the back half will be cut.

When the flares are fitted where you want them mark the outside of the flare so that when you take the flare off you have a guide as to where the flare sits. This will give you an idea of how much you can take off the door. Now each to there own here, take off what YOU want and what YOU think will be enough. When deciding how much to take off there are a few things to consider like, what size wheels will I use, how low is the car, what loads will I carry, will the car be used for track work, is the car fitted with a drop tank, again think of 3 people in the back and full tank of fuel (if you can afford to fill it up that is).
I used a texta as I will have to paint the outside of the door. If you think you can do it without painting then use a pencil that will rub off. This picture shows the front half removed so don't be confused. But first check to see if your happy with the fit on the inside. This picture shows the near perfect fit of the flare onto the contour of the door.
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If I'm happy I mark the outside of the flare. This picture was taken with the front half removed but don't take it off yet. I got a bit ahead of myself.
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I then mark on the inside of the door where I want the cut made. Please note I have marked the ridge where the flare sits against. This ridge hold the flare in the correct position so I want to leave a bit of steel below the ridge to help hold the flare out. I have also marked a spot weld that holds the door skin on. I would not cut lower then this spot weld as this may pull the door skin away from the frame before you get a chance to weld the door which could distort the door skin. The dotted line is where I will make the cut, as you can see there will be a fair bit removed but this is what the owner wanted.
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I then carry this mark around the corner and onto the flare which will help me line up the rear cut later.
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I then close the door and mark the rear flare at the same point as the front half.
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Remove the door flare and prepare yourself for cutting the door. Ear and eye protection and guard on your grinder (sorry could not help myself) then cut along your cut line. This picture is halfway through the door cut.
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And then all off.

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This is how the door looks after the piece is removed. There is a bit of a gap but we can improve on this with a bit of tidy up work.
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[Ruts]

When I'm happy with the door cut I close the door and then mark the inner dog leg tracing from the cut in the door. Note that door cut matches with the mark on the rear flare.
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The line on the dog leg is where I will make the cut in the dog leg.
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Well I was lucky with this one the line on the dog leg met up with the edge that I had already cut on the 1/4 panel. Better by myself a lottery ticket.
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When I'm happy with the cut line on the dog leg I cut away.
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When the cuts are made you will probably have a rough line. I then take my trusty Rupes grinder and with 36 grit attached I clean up all the cut edges. PLEASE BE CAREFULL AT THIS POINT. THE GRINDER CAN CATCH THE EDGE OF THE PANEL AND TAKE OFF SO PLEASE PLEASE BE CAREFULL. If you do not feel confident with a paper grinder then use a stone angle grinder to clean up the edges.
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When the grinding is done you should have a nice clean edge to work with.
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Looking up from underneath
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When I'm happy with the edges on the door I use a pair of multi or vice grips and slowly slowly work the inner and outer skins together. Do not clamp them tight as this may pull the outer skin in and distort the door which will cause you to carry out repairs to the now warped door skin. I leave about a 3-4 millimetre gap which I will weld up and smooth off.
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When I'm happy with the gap between the inner and outer door skins I take my trusty mig welder
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and start to weld up the door a bit at a time to prevent panel distortion.
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After tacking the door I then work the inner dog leg out to meet the outer leg. Remember slow and steady wins the race.
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When I get the inner dog leg close to the outer I use a pair of vice grips and get the two close in the same manner as the door. Remember about 3-4 millimetres then weld up the gap. Just like the door don not clamp them tight as this will distort the outer dog leg and you will have to repair the area where the clamps were attached.
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When the door flare is refitted you can see the difference from when we started and exactly how much more room we have underneath.
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And how much we removed
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Well that's it for now. Tomorrow I will be filling up the gap between the inner and outer skins on the 1/4 panel and finishing off the welds.

remember if you have questions please ask and if you want photo's from different angles just let me know.

Ruts.

Attached Files

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