I've been thinking about this for a while and with about 20 + years of project experience I wanted to share to help others. I would also like others to input their ideas and maybe it can be made as a sticky..
Project Management Tips
If you fail to plan, then you plan to fail!
This quote is so appropriate for this topic. So many great ideas end up as someone else jig saw puzzle or a bare metal rusted shell in your parents back yard until the have had enough and call the car bodies removal company while your out..
Before you even start
Get yourself a note pad, project book (foolscap books are great) and a diary. (You'll see why later)
Some important issues to address first and foremost before you even undo a bolt.
What do you want?
You need to know from the start what your whole aim is for your car. Do you want a drag, cruiser, retro or a show car?
Once you have worked out this then write it down and what you expect to do with the car.
An LX with an angry 355, high stall converter and loud exhaust system isn't going to be the most pleasant car to drive interstate for example.
Once you have worked out your needs are for the car and want you want wrote it down and stick to them. Here's an example...
-My project (I've used my own car for this example)
Style-Retro style. Clean old school lines and late model technology.
Aim-UC coupe with late model reliable engine/drive line.
Intended use- To be able to drive daily or even interstate if needed, be good on fuel, hassle free and power to boot.
Engine and drive line choice-RB25DET, R33 gearbox and 9 inch.
Degree of difficulty- Moderate, parts are available to make this happen. Although gearbox tunnel and chassis works needs to be done.
The law-After consulting engineer I have found out that this is possible and legal with certificate.
Budget-$20k
Time to build-2 years
Now that this is done you can have a clear picture of what your goal and to stay focused. Remember you build a car for you, not what others think you should do.
Diverting, changing your mind can lead to very expensive. I know a drag car project that has been going for 7 years and he keeps changing his mind. Standard wheelbase 9", then it went to tubed 9" and finally 4 link with wilwood brakes.
That was just the rear end of the car...
The approach methods
Drive/build do it yourself method
You know, drive the car Monday to Friday and then Saturday and Sunday your restore it, back together just in time to drive on Monday again.
Pro's
-You can still drive your car and enjoy every mod as you go.
-You can save some money by doing it yourself.
-The learning experience is priceless.
Con's
-Don't expect any free weekends for a few years.
-The amount of double handling is insane.
-By the time your done you'll have to go back and start on the first item.
-Constant pressure to get it ready to drive again leads to rough work.
-Cop bait, plain and simple.
-The amount of stuff you need to get/buy cause your doing it all yourself.
As you can tell not my favorite approach cause I've been there and done that.
Off the road and all do it yourself
You have had enough of bit by bit and so it come time to park in the garage for that final time.
Pro's
-By the time you have finished you would have enough tools to open up your own supercheap store.
-You become so multi skilled that you question if you are even human anymore.
-Nothing better than having some mates, a garage and some beers.
-The most rewarding approach ever.
-By far the cheapest approach ever.
-You get to find out who your real mates are.
Con's
-You'll almost need a 3 car garage to do this, unless your super organize and if so, leave your chair and fly around the room now.
-The amount of parts you have lying around is amazing..
-Tooling up for every area of the project can get expensive.
-If your living with mum and dad, then you're in trouble 24/7.
-Very, very easy to loose interest because you have to do all of it.
-Staying focused on the task at hand is unbelievably hard.
Sub contract out
You do all the ground work, stripping, chasing parts and get others to the major work like paint, engine, suspension etc..
This is best seen in shows like drive or pimp my ride. They have all the right people to the do the right jobs.
Pro's
-A very rewarding experience as you help it all fall into place.
-If planned right it can be a very quick project indeed.
-You can save thousands of dollars this way. Your not paying someone to undo a bolt.
-You still have certain level of control.
-The quality of the job is excellent (providing who you use) as compare to painting a car for the first time in the back yard to a pro in a booth.
Con's
-Hardest part is finding reliable contractors ie painters that promise 6 weeks that turn into 8 months.
-It will cost more than doing it all your self.
-You'll be surprise how busy you will be chasing up rubbers, bolts, gaskets and dropping stuff off.
-I hope you have other transport.
Here you go, just do it method
If money is not an option and you rather be making money than pulling stuff off than it's for you.
Pro's
-You actually have a life. You'll get the odd phone call or go and check out what happening.
-Can be a very stress free experience.
-You don't need to tool up or have parts everywhere.
-The pleasure of a turn key project.
Con's
-Often places will try and built there dream car with your wallet. Stick to your plan.
-Can get out of hand real quick and expensive.
-The cost can be very expensive.
Now lets assume that you will be tearing the car down your self. Here's some tips that I have learned from over 20 years experience tinkering as my wife calls it.
-Do your homework. Plane and simple.
-Plan ahead. I use the note book to write things down to keep my head clear. Then it goes into the project book under what ever the area I'm thinking about and finally in the diary. What day to achieve what and shopping lists for parts needed.
-I have 2 whiteboards and there's no way can Go without them.
-Pace yourself. Not point hitting the 12am, wondering around fluffing for the next 2 hours.
-Be realistic. You can't build a $20k on an apprentice wage in 6 months in your mums laundry.
-Snaplock sandwich bags. I spent about 3 days stripping my car cause every bolt that came off went in a bag and was labeled. I even put a bolt that I wanted to replace with new ones in a sample bag with the number needed.
-Every part was boxed, written was in it , box number and all was recorded in project book.
-Things that I wanted to get painted or reco would be written down as I go.
Conclusion
I really hope that this can help people out there and others cans add. Brain is fading and back i getting sore.
I'm also off the shed to tinker...
Enjoy..
Project management
Started by
_studricho_
, Jan 11 2009 08:11 PM
42 replies to this topic
#2
rodomo
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Posted 11 January 2009 - 11:50 PM
I've got 5 projects on the go at the moment and now I'm confused. 
Thanks mate!
Thanks mate!
#3
_studricho_
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Posted 12 January 2009 - 12:07 AM
I've got 5 projects on the go at the moment and now I'm confused.
Thanks mate!
Nothing wrong with multiple projects. I do it myself all the time. People ask me how I do it, so I show them the white board or project book.
I have 5 plus going most times myself. I find you get more done, cause you can do as much as you can, order parts and then on to the next one so on.
I hate when all the parts come in at once though....
#4
rodomo
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Posted 12 January 2009 - 12:10 AM
Nothing wrong with multiple projects. I do it myself all the time. People ask me how I do it, so I show them the white board.
I end up covered in black texta
#5
_MY-V6-OK_
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Posted 12 January 2009 - 03:10 AM
Very good read you have put together studricho .
I to am doing a project and those snap lock bags do come in handy so do milk crates to store all the parts in .I will have to give the white board a go save's writing everything down on scrap paper then trying to find it later...
I to am doing a project and those snap lock bags do come in handy so do milk crates to store all the parts in .I will have to give the white board a go save's writing everything down on scrap paper then trying to find it later...
#6
View GaragePosted 12 January 2009 - 06:08 AM
Good stuff studricho
A really useful thing I've found (especially for longer term projects) is to take lots of photos of every stage of the strip-down process. Notes and labels are great, but photos show things you never even thought of - along with how to put it back together right!
A really useful thing I've found (especially for longer term projects) is to take lots of photos of every stage of the strip-down process. Notes and labels are great, but photos show things you never even thought of - along with how to put it back together right!
#7
_mumstaxi_
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Posted 12 January 2009 - 08:37 AM
Nice job studricho.
Yes this^^ is a good tip,when stuffing around with the my conversion i took pic's of the ENG in its "trial fit" position ,plus things like clearance issues in particular places that needed cutting or modification, i found in some cases you could also approximate size and distance etc from the pictures quite well, when necessary.
If you have digital camera it takes seconds to take heaps of pic's and costs almost nothing, so if you only get one little piece of info from them, its been worth it !
Also,not sure if it's just me, but after starting many projects over the years myself, i now find when working out how much any decent size project will all cost , whatever $ figure i come up with at the start, i almost double it to give myself a more "accurate" amount of money i actually "will" have spent at the projects end.
MT
Yes this^^ is a good tip,when stuffing around with the my conversion i took pic's of the ENG in its "trial fit" position ,plus things like clearance issues in particular places that needed cutting or modification, i found in some cases you could also approximate size and distance etc from the pictures quite well, when necessary.
If you have digital camera it takes seconds to take heaps of pic's and costs almost nothing, so if you only get one little piece of info from them, its been worth it !
Also,not sure if it's just me, but after starting many projects over the years myself, i now find when working out how much any decent size project will all cost , whatever $ figure i come up with at the start, i almost double it to give myself a more "accurate" amount of money i actually "will" have spent at the projects end.
MT
#8
Struggler
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Posted 12 January 2009 - 08:52 AM
One thing that people seem to get wrong a lot (if its a modified vehicle as opposed to an authentic restoration)..... paint it last, not first. Get the car together and running as it will be, then strip it back down , paint it and reassemble. It does sound like a lot of work but the finished job is heaps neater and final reassembly is pretty quick. The last LX I did took 9 months to get to the paint stage, then only 3 days to reassemble.
JMHO
JMHO
#9
Statler
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Posted 12 January 2009 - 09:32 AM
Well done studricho.You have obviously put a lot of thought into that, & identified a few traps for the enthusiastic!
Why is it that i never have time & $$$ at the same time?
A whiteboard can be a better tool than a socket set!
Cheers, Col.
#10
MRLXSS
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Posted 12 January 2009 - 10:01 AM
Good write up Paul!
I need to invest in some walls for the carport before, so i can hang up the whiteboard! LOL
I need to invest in some walls for the carport before, so i can hang up the whiteboard! LOL
#11
ToRunYa
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Posted 12 January 2009 - 10:04 AM
my whiteboard has consisteded of a note on the fridge with "can't get the $^%&in piece of sh&^ to fit here *cry*
....tim reads it then goes and does it. because if its on the fridge he knows i wont cook
emotional blackmail helps alot in car rebuilds
....tim reads it then goes and does it. because if its on the fridge he knows i wont cook
emotional blackmail helps alot in car rebuilds
#12
_Yella SLuR_
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Posted 16 January 2009 - 11:31 AM
Meh, I do that for a living, my cars are all about escape from work!!!!
In Project Management terms, I have little money, I want top quality, so hence need to spend a great deal of time, which I don't mind, it's a great escape. The old time, cost, quality trilogy.
In Project Management terms, I have little money, I want top quality, so hence need to spend a great deal of time, which I don't mind, it's a great escape. The old time, cost, quality trilogy.
#13
_moot_
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Posted 17 January 2009 - 07:21 AM
i say dont plan,get an idea in your head and do a very realistic budget and then add 30% to it because it does blow out.
as someone in the trade of working on modified cars,i can safely say that you WILL change things along the way,people need to cut budgets,or they come into more money etc. so get a rough idea in your head and just keep going
as someone in the trade of working on modified cars,i can safely say that you WILL change things along the way,people need to cut budgets,or they come into more money etc. so get a rough idea in your head and just keep going
#14
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Posted 25 January 2009 - 10:28 PM
Whiteboard sounds like a bloody good idea! Nice write up.
#15
_studricho_
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Posted 08 February 2009 - 03:20 PM
Some very good input from other members. That's a great idea with digital camera and I have been using it for the last few years. When I started my UC project is was way back when digital cameras cos mega bucks.
I've been lurking around wreckers lately and it's a great place to unwind/think about your project....
I've been lurking around wreckers lately and it's a great place to unwind/think about your project....
#16
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Posted 08 March 2009 - 09:34 PM
That's good for paint quality, but I reckon you should do the body prep work first. If you do all the mechanical work, then find a big chunk of rust in the body that you didn't realise was there, then sometimes you have just wasted your time. As struggler says, you shouldn't paint it untill you know exactly how it's gonna go together, sometimes plans change. But make sure you know exactly what you're dealing with before making major commitments. Get the body prepped before doing any significant work to it, otherwise you may find yourself doing the same work over again to a different car.One thing that people seem to get wrong a lot (if its a modified vehicle as opposed to an authentic restoration)..... paint it last, not first. Get the car together and running as it will be, then strip it back down , paint it and reassemble. It does sound like a lot of work but the finished job is heaps neater and final reassembly is pretty quick. The last LX I did took 9 months to get to the paint stage, then only 3 days to reassemble.
JMHO
#17
_nial8r_
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Posted 15 May 2009 - 11:15 AM
well said paul good write up even though i just stubbled across it now 
me thinks i need a white board as i get sick of writing " TO DO LISTS " and before i know it i have a million bits of paper with stuff on them that i cant even remember about your to orginised dude its makes it more fun when you have misplaced something as it also means more shed time 
"reminder to self :- 10 x lrg white boards for shed "
Cheers Lee
me thinks i need a white board as i get sick of writing " TO DO LISTS " and before i know it i have a million bits of paper with stuff on them that i cant even remember about your to orginised dude its makes it more fun when you have misplaced something as it also means more shed time "reminder to self :- 10 x lrg white boards for shed "
Cheers Lee
#18
_Torrie Envy_
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Posted 02 November 2009 - 11:07 PM
I think I'm gonna like it here...first thread I look at and I think I am in love! 
I hope to see you around some more in here!
I hope to see you around some more in here!
#19
TerrA LX
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Posted 03 November 2009 - 12:11 AM
May I suggest staging the project if your budget, time or living/storage arrangements are limited?
By staging I mean set a goal over a certain period, like say 3 months to prep/paint the body, then it can be stored while things like running gear fall into place.
As struggler suggested, if you are modifying stuff, it will pay to perform these mods before painting to prevent damage to the final finish.
Setting a timeframe with goals also helps your motivation as you get to each point you can say to yourself, "well done" or "better get the finger out".
By staging I mean set a goal over a certain period, like say 3 months to prep/paint the body, then it can be stored while things like running gear fall into place.
As struggler suggested, if you are modifying stuff, it will pay to perform these mods before painting to prevent damage to the final finish.
Setting a timeframe with goals also helps your motivation as you get to each point you can say to yourself, "well done" or "better get the finger out".
#20
_lxss5l_
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Posted 31 January 2010 - 04:44 PM
Very good topic studricho,I agree and can relate with all these comments.When i first started when i was 15 i didn't realy have a clue all i was focust on was i wonted the nicest,quickest,badest torana that i couldn't afford to build and no were to build it.And there was no way i wasn't going to do it and no one els in my family was into cars.All i can say is it's funny but consciously i'v done the text book of what not to do if you wont your car on the road.like poor planning and changing direction and or beter parts ofter paying lots for an alredy new setup and even buying other cars with money that was saved for the project but to good to pass up and doing every thing my self having to ether improvise make or buy parts and tools for every thing.Actually i dont remember having obsessive compulsive before i bought my first torana lol.I find it very hard not to bite of more than i can chew,even though i think i'm geting a bit more realistic.
#21
_cruiza_
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Posted 31 January 2010 - 06:30 PM
Good topic and thanks for posting
I had everything boxed bagged etc and shifted the b&*())()( about 10 times over the 6 years the thing was off the road, lol three time I drove a empty shell no interior, doors, bonet, guards etc from old home to new, once right thru the middle of town about 15 km it was fast and load in its lightened state lol. the only thing I miss placed were the screws for the dash facia, I got replacements, lost them, got another set lost them, completed the car and drove it for 4 years and sold it still with those b&*(()()*&&* screwws missing.
My hints for building cars
Take lots of photos before during and after and of everything
Buy new
when you can I wasted a lot of money on reconditioned parts that never worked right and were ulitmatley replaced with new anyway
eg carb 2nd hand $200 spent $600 on it reco-ed then tuned then tuned again and again finally spend $600 on new one $150 on tuning and never looked at it again New can be cheaper
I had everything boxed bagged etc and shifted the b&*())()( about 10 times over the 6 years the thing was off the road, lol three time I drove a empty shell no interior, doors, bonet, guards etc from old home to new, once right thru the middle of town about 15 km it was fast and load in its lightened state lol. the only thing I miss placed were the screws for the dash facia, I got replacements, lost them, got another set lost them, completed the car and drove it for 4 years and sold it still with those b&*(()()*&&* screwws missing.
My hints for building cars
Take lots of photos before during and after and of everything
Buy new
when you can I wasted a lot of money on reconditioned parts that never worked right and were ulitmatley replaced with new anyway
eg carb 2nd hand $200 spent $600 on it reco-ed then tuned then tuned again and again finally spend $600 on new one $150 on tuning and never looked at it again New can be cheaper
#22
FastEHHolden
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Posted 31 January 2010 - 09:48 PM
hehe...I tried to be organised and bagged and tagged the parts...bloody bags deteriorated and everything ended up is a pile in a box.
All that advice is great...my 2 cents is leave the engine until last...do the paint/body work first (boring), interior next (it happens quicker) and getting the engine done gets the blood pumping.
How many projects do you see for sale stuck in the body work phase? how many of them have had good money spent on the engine?
All that advice is great...my 2 cents is leave the engine until last...do the paint/body work first (boring), interior next (it happens quicker) and getting the engine done gets the blood pumping.
How many projects do you see for sale stuck in the body work phase? how many of them have had good money spent on the engine?
#23
_LX350_
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Posted 15 June 2010 - 08:26 PM
Nice write mate,Sandwich bags great idea everything i pull off wires etc always get grey duct tape with nikko description
never have that "is that the right way round???"
Will get myself a book now and sit down and go thru the things u have metioned
Thanks for the well lit road i will be travellin down now !!!!
never have that "is that the right way round???"
Will get myself a book now and sit down and go thru the things u have metioned
Thanks for the well lit road i will be travellin down now !!!!
#24
_studricho_
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Posted 02 July 2010 - 10:19 PM
This thread has slipped my mind and I have just gone over what I have written. I was impressed at what I wrote spelling mistakes and all.
It's good to see that it is/has still help others.
Testimony on this approach
I also restore Motorcycles and in fact I've just opened up my own doors. Anyway I was asked about 2 years ago (maybe more) to help a bloke restore his Yamaha RZ500 from ground up.
The owner bought new back in 1986, crashed after 3,300 klms and let it sit idle for 20 years.
My job was to completely strip it down, rebuild the engine (V4 500cc twin crankshaft engine 2 stroke) and reassemble it.
Now without the above project planning there was no way I would be able to report that the bike started 3rd kick.
I have never worked on a RZ500, but with my notes, baggies and laptop full of pictures I was able to put it together even after 2 years as the customer had money to spend.
Now go out there and build your dream!
It's good to see that it is/has still help others.
Testimony on this approach
I also restore Motorcycles and in fact I've just opened up my own doors. Anyway I was asked about 2 years ago (maybe more) to help a bloke restore his Yamaha RZ500 from ground up.
The owner bought new back in 1986, crashed after 3,300 klms and let it sit idle for 20 years.
My job was to completely strip it down, rebuild the engine (V4 500cc twin crankshaft engine 2 stroke) and reassemble it.
Now without the above project planning there was no way I would be able to report that the bike started 3rd kick.
I have never worked on a RZ500, but with my notes, baggies and laptop full of pictures I was able to put it together even after 2 years as the customer had money to spend.
Now go out there and build your dream!
#25
_73LJWhiteSL_
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Posted 01 October 2010 - 04:26 PM
Just read through this again, awesome thread. Have started planning my own Torana project. Have set out a timeline and what I want to achieve. It may be a little unrealistic, but thats ok, it should keep me moving and hopefully back in a Torana soon.
Steve
Steve
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