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Mounting an alloy radiator

Started by _LHoon_ , Jan 12 2009 02:16 PM

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30 replies to this topic

#1 _LHoon_

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Posted 12 January 2009 - 02:16 PM

Hey guys,
I have recently bought a new PWR alloy radiator.
A few tips from the manufacturer is to run good quality coolant, such as the Commodore V6 stuff. I've also been told to was told that I should be check for stray current in the system to avoid corrosion. That I can do!

They don't mention how it should be mounted. Is it necessary to rubber mount an aluminium radiator?

I look forward to the technical discussion from the experts...
Cheers!
:spoton:

Edited by LHoon, 12 January 2009 - 02:16 PM.

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#2 _LJ355_

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Posted 12 January 2009 - 02:29 PM

Mate im about to mount mine tonight im using VN commodre airbox mounts

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#3 TerrA LX

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Posted 12 January 2009 - 02:33 PM

Radiators should always be rubber mounted to prevent vibration damage.

If there is no other mechanical connection bar the two rubber hoses then you should have no stray currents.
If you have sensors, trans lines etc affixed then you may need to look at earthing the radiator to the chassis as rubber mounting will have isolated it.

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#4 _LHoon_

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Posted 12 January 2009 - 03:27 PM

Mate im about to mount mine tonight im using VN commodre airbox mounts

Sounds interesting, hmmm... are they those quick release clip things that are used to hold the two plastic parts together? I'm guessing not. Maybe you can take a picture once you're done?

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#5 _LHoon_

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Posted 12 January 2009 - 03:29 PM

Radiators should always be rubber mounted to prevent vibration damage.

Are standard Torana radiators rubber mounted?

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#6 Struggler

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Posted 12 January 2009 - 03:36 PM

Are standard Torana radiators rubber mounted?

Yes but most people have tossed the insulators out over the years.

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#7 TerrA LX

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Posted 12 January 2009 - 04:01 PM

^ What he said.

Edited by ALX76, 12 January 2009 - 04:03 PM.

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#8 ls2lxhatch

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Posted 12 January 2009 - 04:51 PM

It has been discussed in this thread.
http://www.gmh-toran.......rrent&st=27

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#9 ls2lxhatch

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Posted 12 January 2009 - 05:42 PM

Yes but most people have tossed the insulators out over the years.

The LX parts catalogue pages 88,89 and 90 (90, 91 and 92 in pdf) does not show rubber insulators.

You can download the catalogue from this thread.
http://www.gmh-toran...?showtopic=5156

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#10 _LJ355_

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Posted 12 January 2009 - 09:09 PM

These are what i thought of using will do the job but i would like it a little closer to the rad support

Posted Image

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#11 _LHoon_

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Posted 12 January 2009 - 09:11 PM

That parts manual is great! Pitty there's not a copy for LC/LJ.

I am installing the radiator into an LC. I doubt there were ever rubber mounts, never seen them before.

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#12 _LHoon_

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Posted 12 January 2009 - 09:37 PM

These are what i thought of using will do the job but i would like it a little closer to the rad support

Looks pretty good LJ355. Do you know whether the stud in the rubber goes all the way through?
It shouldn't, otherwise your radiator would be earthed through the nut and stud.

My setup is a little different. I have cut away some of the front panel where it normally mounts, and made the radiator as wide as what fits between the chassis rails. I have also made my own aluminium shroud for two 12" fans, so I don't have quite as much room as you.

Posted Image

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#13 ls2lxhatch

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Posted 12 January 2009 - 10:00 PM

You could try fitting a rubber wiring grommet in the radiator or the radiator support panel and putting the bolt through the rubber grommet with a washer and nylock on the back.

It would probably be better to fit the grommet to the radiator as the aluminium will be thicker than the radiator support panel and therefore less likely to cut through the grommet. You could try a prototype using a bit of alloy the same thickness as the radiator.

Something like this.
http://www.parts4car...category_id=438

Edited by ls2lxhatch, 12 January 2009 - 10:06 PM.

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#14 _LHoon_

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Posted 12 January 2009 - 10:08 PM

That's a really good idea. I'll do that!
:spoton:

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#15 _ass308_

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Posted 13 January 2009 - 06:36 AM

thats a really nice engine bay lhoon,looking good.
im by no means a expert,but my pwr radiator is just getting bolted straight up with no rubber.i have never seen a torana with a rubber mounted radiator.that doesnt mean they dont exist.
lj355,im not so sure the gaps around the radiator are a good idea,they give the air flow somewhere else to go besides straight through the radiator.
just my 2cents worth

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#16 _Herne_

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Posted 13 January 2009 - 09:18 AM

I visited the PWR tent whilst at Summernats, Callums father was with me at the time and I asked a PWR rep if an alloy radiator should be rubber mounted his reply was NO we never advise rubber mounts as they are not necessary.

Now I am not here to debate the whys are wherefores of rubber mounts I am merely passing on what was told directly to me.

BTW Callums father has or at least had the reps card so we have his name

I found their radiators to be very expensive even whilst on sale at the Nats. Probably paying for the name behind the product.

Herne

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#17 _mumstaxi_

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Posted 13 January 2009 - 10:45 AM

Interesting, never seen or had a Torana with a "rubber mounted" radiator, could someone post pic's of a factory set up with rubber mounts please ?

When i take into consideration the weight of my 3 core radiator + water + thermo fans, not so sure id wan't that bouncing around over bumps etc ?

Has anyone ever had a problem caused by solid mounted RAD ? and what happened ?

I was under the impression that the rubber mounting of radiators only came about in later model cars that used "plastic" radiator tanks, i thought the rubber mounts was to reduce the stress/vibration on the plastic tanks as the radiator hoses "tugged" under engine movement ?

LJ355 (love your car by the way),i would not recommend the use those rubber airbox mounts (have used them myself in other applications), they are not designed to support a radiator full af water, and will almost certainly sag or tear dramatically under such "Shear Force"

MT

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#18 _SableMet7/73_

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Posted 13 January 2009 - 02:20 PM

Gday,
LJ parts catalogue dosnt list a radiator mount grommet
but my HQ cat lists 4 of for 6 & all the 8 cylinder cars
part #SP2382.
I think from memory I scrounged them out of a HX or Z
but it was a while ago (84 or 85) when there were still lots
of pretty much untouched cars at the wreckers & the rubber
was still useable & not hard & perished. If I get a chance I'll
check the size of the mount holes in the LJ radiator support a
see if the'll fit. Spose you could always enlarge the hole if
needed tho.

Jono

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#19 _LJ355_

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Posted 13 January 2009 - 09:14 PM

Decided not to use those mounts i like ls2hatchs idea of the wiring grommets will give that a go

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#20 _LHoon_

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Posted 14 January 2009 - 07:52 AM

I visited the PWR tent whilst at Summernats, Callums father was with me at the time and I asked a PWR rep if an alloy radiator should be rubber mounted his reply was NO we never advise rubber mounts as they are not necessary.

I'm inclined now to solid mount my radiator. It makes sense that such a heavy component be rigidly mounted to the chassis.
Still concerned about electrolysis though. Is it worth trying to isolate it still?

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#21 _Herne_

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Posted 14 January 2009 - 08:05 AM

Yes mate, make up your own mind and go with whatever you decide, I cant advise you either way on this as I have no idea.

I did also ask about electrolysis and sacrificial anodes etc and the same guy said no need to worry about any of that either.

The salesman gave me the impression that he knew what he was talking about but then again some salesmen can lay it on thick with a trowel (eh Jeremy) lol

Cheers
Herne

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#22 _j7723_

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Posted 14 January 2009 - 09:16 AM

HA HA HA trust me Im a used car salesman

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#23 ls2lxhatch

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Posted 14 January 2009 - 09:42 AM

From this thread.
http://www.gmh-toran.......rrent&st=27

Some tech articles recommend grounding the radiator and others recommend you do not ground the radiator. There seems to be more support for grounding the radiator.

They all agree that you must use appropriate coolant and test for stray current regularly using a multimeter (see Nulon document ) or dedicated device (Koolit Indicator). Apparently brass/copper radiators are also susceptible to stray current corrosion.

Nulon Facts Sheet

So, why are we seeing more stray current related radiator failures these days? A good example of how modern radiators are so vulnerable to stray current corrosion is that many of them are attached to the vehicle by their plastic tanks, or are insulated from the vehicle chassis by rubber mounts.

http://www.radiatorr...m/electrol.html

Take electrolysis, for example. Before the days of front wheel drive and transverse-mounted engines, cooling system electrolysis was a rare occurrence. But today, with most cars and many light-duty trucks featuring electric cooling fans in conjunction with ungrounded plastic-tank radiators, cooling system electrolysis is becoming a frequent problem.

http://www.birdsradi...lectrolysis.nxg

Early on, when electrolysis first cropped up as a problem in cooling systems, many mechanics attempted to solve the problem by grounding the heater or radiator in order to "collect" any stray voltage and route it to battery ground. But mechanics soon discovered that grounding a heat exchanger to "collect" stray current merely accelerated the damage to the heat exchanger.

KOOL-IT� Electrolysis Indicator

Edited by ls2lxhatch, 14 January 2009 - 09:43 AM.

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#24 TerrA LX

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Posted 14 January 2009 - 12:06 PM

That is WAY too big a gap between the radiator and the support.
Even tho you have two monster fans hanging off the back, they are prolly on more run time that they need to be cause at cruise the airflow will take the path of least resistance.

The factory mounts never held it up that far from the support.