Looking at giving some welding a go to do some rust repairs on my lj. Before trying it on my on the car, i want to give it a go with just a couple of pieces of scrap but now sure what gauge/thinkness metal to use. I'll be using a gas/gasless mig ive got off a mate.
If im hopeless theres no way i'll be touching the old girl but any help would be great.
Not trying to cut costs on my build but id feel more satisfied with myself if i know i can stand back and say, i built that.
Cheers, Mat
What Gauge metal to use
Started by
_OZZ80Y_
, Jun 29 2010 08:50 PM
32 replies to this topic
#2
wot179
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Posted 29 June 2010 - 08:53 PM
1mm,or 20gauge cold rolled mild steel,otherwise known as bright mild steel.
Or you could just cut up an old door.
Or you could just cut up an old door.
#3
Rockoz
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Posted 29 June 2010 - 09:52 PM
Do yourself a favour and buy gas wire, a gas kit and hire yourself a bottle of gas.
Will work out easier and probably cheaper.
Will work out easier and probably cheaper.
#4
_OZZ80Y_
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Posted 29 June 2010 - 10:18 PM
thanks wot179 and rockoz
the welder i have uses gas, its a toolex 140n, uses argon C02 gas. The misses old man works for boc so the gas on't be a problem.
Im from western sydney, anyone able to tell me where i can get some steel. Can i get it from bunnings.
Cheers
the welder i have uses gas, its a toolex 140n, uses argon C02 gas. The misses old man works for boc so the gas on't be a problem.
Im from western sydney, anyone able to tell me where i can get some steel. Can i get it from bunnings.
Cheers
#5
_nial8r_
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Posted 30 June 2010 - 07:37 AM
good on ya for having ago your self mate 
hit your local panel shop and grab a bonnet of them or a couple of old doors that you can cut up like wot179 said, before going out and buying a sheet of metal, i went a got a bonnet of 1 of my local panle shops and it has more than enough metal for my project. the only piece of metal i am gonna have to buy is for the boot floor because i am going for a smooth floor ! i dont think Bunnings would sell sheets of metal but again your local panel shop shouldbe able to help you out with that also, hope it helps 
hit your local panel shop and grab a bonnet of them or a couple of old doors that you can cut up like wot179 said, before going out and buying a sheet of metal, i went a got a bonnet of 1 of my local panle shops and it has more than enough metal for my project. the only piece of metal i am gonna have to buy is for the boot floor because i am going for a smooth floor ! i dont think Bunnings would sell sheets of metal but again your local panel shop shouldbe able to help you out with that also, hope it helps
#6
Statler
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Posted 30 June 2010 - 08:27 AM
Raid the scrap bin of any sheet metal shop.
Grab some different thickness material & try all of them.
Grab some different thickness material & try all of them.
Edited by Statler, 30 June 2010 - 08:28 AM.
#7
_freddy_
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Posted 30 June 2010 - 01:00 PM
just do wat i have been doing for afew years just practice if you burn a hole in it just weld it up and if you carnt get a continues weld for a coulpel of secs turn the amps down, and if the wirer keeps pushing the welding gun/headpiece away turn the wire speed down, make sure you have a good earth and clean the area before you weld, and move slower as you turn the wirer speed down. but you will learn how best to do it as you get used to it.
hope this helps matthew.
hope this helps matthew.
#8
_Bomber Watson_
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Posted 30 June 2010 - 08:00 PM
Also i would suggest getting some 0.6mm wire for working with sheet metal.
Soooo much nicer with <3mm steel.
Cheers.
Soooo much nicer with <3mm steel.
Cheers.
#9
_OZZ80Y_
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Posted 30 June 2010 - 09:03 PM
Thanks everybody for the advice and encouragement. Going to grab a new bottle of gas tomorrow. I've got an old door which was infested with rust and old boot lid so i think i'll be able to give it a go using pieces from them.
The wire i already have on the welder is .8, how do you think that will go bomber?
I think the only replacement panels i will buy will be floor pans for each sides and lower sill for the pass side.
Well until i find more rust. there is so much high fill over the car.
The wire i already have on the welder is .8, how do you think that will go bomber?
I think the only replacement panels i will buy will be floor pans for each sides and lower sill for the pass side.
Well until i find more rust. there is so much high fill over the car.
#10
_freddy_
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Posted 30 June 2010 - 09:45 PM
just take your time with the weldin and try different things you will love weldin with a gas mig:rockon:
#11
_nial8r_
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Posted 01 July 2010 - 08:33 AM
.8 is fine like it was said above just take your time and play around with your settings a bit and you will fine a happy medium and remember your only welding 20gauge steel so its very easy to blow holes in it. try starting of by doing a couple of tac welds 1st to see if your getting good penitration then move on to 10 - 20mm runs letting each run cool before starting your next run to stop and major warpage. after you have done a couple of practice piece's post some pic's so we can have a look see and let you know if its looking the goods
#12
_Bomber Watson_
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Posted 01 July 2010 - 05:41 PM
Yeah i had .8 in mine, was great for 3-6mm thick steel, on on 1.6 but pretty useless for 1mm
The .6 is way better, but the .8 will do it.
Cheers.
The .6 is way better, but the .8 will do it.
Cheers.
#13
Statler
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Posted 01 July 2010 - 06:04 PM
0.6 isn't welding wire!... it's boliermakers dental floss 
#14
_nial8r_
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Posted 01 July 2010 - 08:52 PM
im using 0.6 now in my mig but was gonna go up to 0.8 only cause i can 
nah the last 5kg roll i got was all i could get at the time so once its gone it will be another roll of 0.8
nah the last 5kg roll i got was all i could get at the time so once its gone it will be another roll of 0.8
#15
71xu1
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Posted 02 July 2010 - 11:26 AM
For 1mm panel steel 0.6mm wire is the way to go, sure you can use 0.8 guage wire. It just equals more heat more buildup, more grinding.
Hope this helps cheers Dave
Hope this helps cheers Dave
#16
_dirtbag_
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Posted 18 July 2010 - 12:21 AM
Bomber is right there. 0.6mm is good for panel steel. Having said that I use 0.8 or 0.9mm as I generally am doing more chassis work than body work, but I can still get the job done with 0.8mm no probs.
As for steel, use zincaneal (spelling??). It's much more rust resilliant, stronger and around here anyway it's easier to find. Bright or black steel is good if you're making a roof skin or bootlid or something with an english wheel as it's softer. Anyway, any sheet will do : ) Yes, that's my weak excuse for a "sh1t" joke : )
When I do panel work, I use 1.2mm zinc, just so you know.
As for steel, use zincaneal (spelling??). It's much more rust resilliant, stronger and around here anyway it's easier to find. Bright or black steel is good if you're making a roof skin or bootlid or something with an english wheel as it's softer. Anyway, any sheet will do : ) Yes, that's my weak excuse for a "sh1t" joke : )
When I do panel work, I use 1.2mm zinc, just so you know.
#17
TerrA LX
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Posted 18 July 2010 - 12:56 AM
I used to use zinc anneal or zinc seal, 1.6mm alot as it was either that or 1mm in the shop and preferred to work with the 1.6mm.
#18
71xu1
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Posted 18 July 2010 - 07:14 PM
Only one way to go 1mm cold rolled mild steel for panel work. Zinc anneal isn't malleable enough to be able to form sections properly, poisinous fumes are emitted when welding and if you don't grind the zinc off before welding you get porous welds.
Cheers Dave
Cheers Dave
#19
Toran the Carbarian
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Posted 24 January 2011 - 12:45 PM
Are the rear "chassis rail" sections of an LH the same gauge as the panels or something a bit thicker? I am wanting to patch some big rust holes just forward of the rear axle.
Cheers
Max
Cheers
Max
#20
_Liam_
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Posted 24 January 2011 - 05:25 PM
All outer skin metal is the same thickness, just reinforced by other sheets in some sections. They should all be the same thickness.
#21
_Yella SLuR_
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Posted 24 January 2011 - 06:56 PM
Chassis rails are thicker. Have a look under your front guard towards the front where it is doubled up for the bumper bar support. Dunno how thick, approx. 2.4m or better.
Sheet metal supply: Offcuts from a steel/metal shop, they are the ones that also sell sheet, and most do a little in-house fabrication.
Practice: Start by playing with the settings and just weld some lines across the face, looking at speed, and penetration. Also settings, there are some settings on a mig Amps/wire feed that will not weld, you need to find the settings that work (nice sharp cracking sound)
Next try some spot welds butting pieces together. Lie the plates flat on something that can take heat (welding block) and slightly angle plates apart to allow for them pinching together as you spot them.
Next try seam weld the butt joint above.
Have fun.
I also have a TIG attachment for my stick welder. Can't do Ally, but gives a nice exact flame, and a bit more farking around, but I like it. Can weld anything of any thickness, and temperature control is great, but you have to sharpen the tungsten electrodes fairly regularly. Also different electrodes for different metals, but I mainly only do steel and stainless.
Sheet metal supply: Offcuts from a steel/metal shop, they are the ones that also sell sheet, and most do a little in-house fabrication.
Practice: Start by playing with the settings and just weld some lines across the face, looking at speed, and penetration. Also settings, there are some settings on a mig Amps/wire feed that will not weld, you need to find the settings that work (nice sharp cracking sound)
Next try some spot welds butting pieces together. Lie the plates flat on something that can take heat (welding block) and slightly angle plates apart to allow for them pinching together as you spot them.
Next try seam weld the butt joint above.
Have fun.
I also have a TIG attachment for my stick welder. Can't do Ally, but gives a nice exact flame, and a bit more farking around, but I like it. Can weld anything of any thickness, and temperature control is great, but you have to sharpen the tungsten electrodes fairly regularly. Also different electrodes for different metals, but I mainly only do steel and stainless.
Edited by Yella SLuR, 24 January 2011 - 07:05 PM.
#22
_Yella SLuR_
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Posted 24 January 2011 - 07:11 PM
^ I couldn't weld for shit when I left school (long time ago, I convinced myself I liked timber...pffft).
Did a car restoration course at TAFE at night, and shite, part of it was oxy welding. Turned out when shown how I was quite good at it, so went and did a Welding and Thermal Cutting Course after that!!! That Car Restoration course was the best course I ever did. First part is a bit obscure (hub cap and wheel chock from sheet metal), but next bit is good (repairing chisel gashes to doors, patch panels to corners of doors, and panel preparation for paint).
You can do shite like this (was ready for the tip):
You'll also need some more tools: plenishing hammer, dolly, speedfile, bodyfile, mallet as starters.
Good luck with it.
Did a car restoration course at TAFE at night, and shite, part of it was oxy welding. Turned out when shown how I was quite good at it, so went and did a Welding and Thermal Cutting Course after that!!! That Car Restoration course was the best course I ever did. First part is a bit obscure (hub cap and wheel chock from sheet metal), but next bit is good (repairing chisel gashes to doors, patch panels to corners of doors, and panel preparation for paint).
You can do shite like this (was ready for the tip):
You'll also need some more tools: plenishing hammer, dolly, speedfile, bodyfile, mallet as starters.
Good luck with it.
Edited by Yella SLuR, 24 January 2011 - 07:21 PM.
#23
_TorYoda_
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Posted 24 January 2011 - 10:08 PM
Oxy welding (or brazing) is your worst enemy on sheet steel car panels. Any form of flame welding burns the carbon from the steel leaving it as tin. Once the carbon is gone tin will rust at an extremely aggressive rate if it cannot be properly prepped and sealed on Both sides. TIG is not as bad as oxy, However if you can master the mig with .6mm wire you will get great results. After many years of experience I can butt weld panel steel with the mig using .6 wire in continuous runs...... I choose to do this to eliminate the overlap joint that holds moisture and assists the start of new rust. Practice with different settings, keep it clean and free of paint/zinc/gal etc and you will soon be getting satisfactory results.
Edited by TorYoda, 24 January 2011 - 10:11 PM.
#24
TerrA LX
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Posted 24 January 2011 - 10:16 PM
Ah tin is not easily oxidised and used to coat other metals to prevent corrosion such as food containers.
#25
wot179
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Posted 24 January 2011 - 10:22 PM
Oxy welding (or brazing) is your worst enemy on sheet steel car panels. Any form of flame welding burns the carbon from the steel leaving it as tin. Once the carbon is gone tin will rust at an extremely aggressive rate if it cannot be properly prepped and sealed on Both sides. TIG is not as bad as oxy, However if you can master the mig with .6mm wire you will get great results. After many years of experience I can butt weld panel steel with the mig using .6 wire in continuous runs...... I choose to do this to eliminate the overlap joint that holds moisture and assists the start of new rust. Practice with different settings, keep it clean and free of paint/zinc/gal etc and you will soon be getting satisfactory results.
This is dribble.
Oxy is the best if you are good at it.
Which I,unfortunately am not.
It is a dying craft which most metalworkers and panelbeaters no longer use due the time restraints and the skill and training involved.
Panelsteel composition has also changed,which renders it useless on modern vehicles.
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