If we as modified car owners dont do something about this we are doomed maybe we should get your local member of parliament to look into this for you because at the moment the police have all the power
Here is an example we had powercruise here last month on the sunday when most people were leaving the police were busy putting defect notices on cars that were on trailers ffs only if you had your number plates on so if they were off you were fine
Thats what i call miss use of police power but then again things havent changed for years
you queenslanders should get together and make a stand NOW
end of rant
And torbidie suck it up princess
Qld anti hoon laws to be reviewed
Started by
S pack
, Nov 03 2012 11:54 PM
377 replies to this topic
#176
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:05 PM
#177
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:15 PM
Defecting cars on trailers or leaving a venue is an interesitng one.
Few local lads went down to Lancruiser Mountan Park with there comp 4x4's, dedicated competition 4x4 vehicles sitting on car trailers that were rated for the load being towed by vehicles rated to tow the load.
Police pulled them up, and demanded that one lad remove his comp truck from the trailer so the officer "could inspect the trailer"
The lad said sir, do you realize that that car is not registered and not legal, and you are asking me to remove it from this trailer and park it on the public road?
Officer insisted, so he did it, then fined him for unroadworthy vehicle on a public road.
Found that interesting
Few local lads went down to Lancruiser Mountan Park with there comp 4x4's, dedicated competition 4x4 vehicles sitting on car trailers that were rated for the load being towed by vehicles rated to tow the load.
Police pulled them up, and demanded that one lad remove his comp truck from the trailer so the officer "could inspect the trailer"
The lad said sir, do you realize that that car is not registered and not legal, and you are asking me to remove it from this trailer and park it on the public road?
Officer insisted, so he did it, then fined him for unroadworthy vehicle on a public road.
Found that interesting
#178
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:24 PM
To those interested, there is support growing, and alot of discussion etc about the new laws, all across the country. If your on Facebook, head to the Grunt Files page, or head to their website. I'm in NSW, and i have contacted a few politicians about the matter, here is the reply i got from my local MP.
Thank you for your email regarding Hooning Legislation.
Tough measures are in place to combat anti-social ‘car hoon’ behaviour. The laws make it clear for those irresponsible drivers that treat NSW roads as their own personal race track that this type of selfish and dangerous behaviour will not be tolerated. From 1 July 2012, changes are being made to the Vehicle Sanctions Scheme that Police apply at the roadside for 'hoon' type behaviour. The changes are as follows:
New offences
The existing offences of street racing and aggravated burnout continue to apply, however the offences of 'engaging in a Police pursuit' and 'speeding by more than 45km/h' will be included.
Number plate confiscation
Where a driver commits one of the offences above and is the registered operator of the offending vehicle, Police may confiscate the number plates at the roadside as an alternative to the long-standing practice of impounding the vehicle. Vehicle impoundment or plate confiscation will be for a fixed three-month period. A person may apply to the local court for an order for the early release of confiscated plates or an impounded vehicle.
The changes also see the introduction of tough new penalties for those who use a vehicle that has had its number plates confiscated. This includes driving a vehicle with no plates or false plates. Heavy penalties also apply to altering, tampering with or replicating a production notice sticker which Police will attach to a vehicle when number plates are removed.
Court imposed penalties
The maximum penalties for a person who is convicted of vehicle or plate confiscation offences are as follows:
The maximum penalty for a person who is convicted of a street racing or 'hoon' offence are as follows:
Immediate licence suspension
Police can also immediately suspend a driver’s licence at the roadside following a person being charged with a street racing or aggravated burnout offence. The suspension will remain in place until the charge is determined by a court.
The aggravated burnout offence can apply to persons other than the driver. For example, a hoon driver’s mate who willingly participates in, urges others to participate in, photographs or films to promote or organise hoon activity can also be charged with the offence and faces the same penalties.
Motor vehicle sanctions
Under the current laws, NSW Police have the power to confiscate the car of a driver who commits a street racing or aggravated burnout offence. From 1 July 2012, the offences of engaging in a police pursuit and speeding by more than 45km/h will be included. Police will also have the additional options to confiscate a vehicle's number plates, or give the driver or registered operator of the vehicle a notice requiring that the vehicle be produced at a specified place within 10 days. If the vehicle is not produced a court imposed penalty of $3,300 can apply, and Roads and Maritime Services may suspend the vehicle’s registration for a period of 3 months.
Where the driver is also the registered operator of the vehicle
In cases where the driver is the registered operator, the vehicle may be impounded or the plates confiscated for a period of 3 months for a first offence. For a second or subsequent offence, the vehicle may be forfeited to the Crown and may be sold or released to Roads and Maritime Services for crash testing (see below for more about crash testing).
Where the driver is not the registered operator of the vehicle
In cases where the driver is not the registered operator, Roads and Maritime Services may issue a suspension warning notice to the registered operator warning that if the same vehicle is used in a second offence, the registration of the vehicle may be suspended for a period of 3 months.
If a second or subsequent offence is committed, the registration of the vehicle may be suspended for a period of 3 months.
It is not intended that vehicle owners be penalised for the driving offence committed, but rather for failing to adequately supervise use of their vehicle on repeated occasions.
Crash testing by Roads and Maritime Services
Current laws already provide that the cars of repeat offenders may be forfeited to the Crown. Usually, those vehicles are sold and the money used to recover storage and collection costs. The new laws allow certain forfeited vehicles to be released to Roads and Maritime Services for crash testing.
Roads and Maritime Services will use the unique tests to investigate the potential effects of certain modifications on overall crashworthiness and the wrecks of these vehicles will be displayed at education days for young drivers, or at other Roads and Maritime Services presentations.
The penalties outlined above only apply to the way vehicles are driven and not to the modification of that vehicle.
I hope this information is of assistance.
Thank you for your email regarding Hooning Legislation.
Tough measures are in place to combat anti-social ‘car hoon’ behaviour. The laws make it clear for those irresponsible drivers that treat NSW roads as their own personal race track that this type of selfish and dangerous behaviour will not be tolerated. From 1 July 2012, changes are being made to the Vehicle Sanctions Scheme that Police apply at the roadside for 'hoon' type behaviour. The changes are as follows:
New offences
The existing offences of street racing and aggravated burnout continue to apply, however the offences of 'engaging in a Police pursuit' and 'speeding by more than 45km/h' will be included.
Number plate confiscation
Where a driver commits one of the offences above and is the registered operator of the offending vehicle, Police may confiscate the number plates at the roadside as an alternative to the long-standing practice of impounding the vehicle. Vehicle impoundment or plate confiscation will be for a fixed three-month period. A person may apply to the local court for an order for the early release of confiscated plates or an impounded vehicle.
The changes also see the introduction of tough new penalties for those who use a vehicle that has had its number plates confiscated. This includes driving a vehicle with no plates or false plates. Heavy penalties also apply to altering, tampering with or replicating a production notice sticker which Police will attach to a vehicle when number plates are removed.
Court imposed penalties
The maximum penalties for a person who is convicted of vehicle or plate confiscation offences are as follows:
- A person convicted of an offence of operating a motor vehicle on a road during a plate confiscation period faces a maximum court imposed fine of $3,300 and vehicle forfeiture.
- A person convicted of an offence or removing, tampering with or modifying a number plate confiscation notice faces a maximum court imposed fine of $3,300 and vehicle forfeiture.
The maximum penalty for a person who is convicted of a street racing or 'hoon' offence are as follows:
The maximum court imposed fine for an aggravated burnout offence is $3,300 for a first offence and $3,300 and/or 9 months imprisonment for a second or subsequent offence. A 12-month automatic period of disqualification also applies following conviction for the offence.
The maximum court imposed fine for a street racing offence is $3,300 for a first offence and $3,300 and/or 9 months imprisonment for a second or subsequent offence. A 12-month automatic period of disqualification applies to those convicted of this offence.
The maximum court imposed fine for an offence of speeding by more than 45km/h is $2,530 for the driver of a light vehicle and $3,740 for the driver of a heavy vehicle. A six-month automatic period of disqualification applies to those convicted of the offence.
The maximum penalty for a police pursuit offence is 3 years imprisonment and a 3-year automatic period of disqualification for a first offence, and 5 years imprisonment and a 5-year automatic period of disqualification for a second or subsequent offence.
Immediate licence suspension
Police can also immediately suspend a driver’s licence at the roadside following a person being charged with a street racing or aggravated burnout offence. The suspension will remain in place until the charge is determined by a court.
The aggravated burnout offence can apply to persons other than the driver. For example, a hoon driver’s mate who willingly participates in, urges others to participate in, photographs or films to promote or organise hoon activity can also be charged with the offence and faces the same penalties.
Motor vehicle sanctions
Under the current laws, NSW Police have the power to confiscate the car of a driver who commits a street racing or aggravated burnout offence. From 1 July 2012, the offences of engaging in a police pursuit and speeding by more than 45km/h will be included. Police will also have the additional options to confiscate a vehicle's number plates, or give the driver or registered operator of the vehicle a notice requiring that the vehicle be produced at a specified place within 10 days. If the vehicle is not produced a court imposed penalty of $3,300 can apply, and Roads and Maritime Services may suspend the vehicle’s registration for a period of 3 months.
Where the driver is also the registered operator of the vehicle
In cases where the driver is the registered operator, the vehicle may be impounded or the plates confiscated for a period of 3 months for a first offence. For a second or subsequent offence, the vehicle may be forfeited to the Crown and may be sold or released to Roads and Maritime Services for crash testing (see below for more about crash testing).
Where the driver is not the registered operator of the vehicle
In cases where the driver is not the registered operator, Roads and Maritime Services may issue a suspension warning notice to the registered operator warning that if the same vehicle is used in a second offence, the registration of the vehicle may be suspended for a period of 3 months.
If a second or subsequent offence is committed, the registration of the vehicle may be suspended for a period of 3 months.
It is not intended that vehicle owners be penalised for the driving offence committed, but rather for failing to adequately supervise use of their vehicle on repeated occasions.
Crash testing by Roads and Maritime Services
Current laws already provide that the cars of repeat offenders may be forfeited to the Crown. Usually, those vehicles are sold and the money used to recover storage and collection costs. The new laws allow certain forfeited vehicles to be released to Roads and Maritime Services for crash testing.
Roads and Maritime Services will use the unique tests to investigate the potential effects of certain modifications on overall crashworthiness and the wrecks of these vehicles will be displayed at education days for young drivers, or at other Roads and Maritime Services presentations.
The penalties outlined above only apply to the way vehicles are driven and not to the modification of that vehicle.
I hope this information is of assistance.
#179
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:25 PM
^^^^That was a regular occurance on the way to Summernats, unregistered cars were instructed to be removed from trailers then the owners booked for driving an unregistered & uninsured vehicle upon a public road.
#180
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:30 PM
^^^^That was a regular occurance on the way to Summernats, unregistered cars were instructed to be removed from trailers then the owners booked for driving an unregistered & uninsured vehicle upon a public road.
Thats frOckin bullshit as i said miss use of power
#181
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:35 PM
can't that be classed as "entrapment"^^^^That was a regular occurance on the way to Summernats, unregistered cars were instructed to be removed from trailers then the owners booked for driving an unregistered & uninsured vehicle upon a public road.
it's my understanding you cannot be forced to break the law....by a official or otherwise
Edited by Quagmire, 12 November 2012 - 07:36 PM.
#182
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:39 PM
Yes it was & thankfully enough people complained & Street Machine magazine who promote Summernats got onboard & that practice stopped. Although i suspect at least one person here will still say the unfortunate owners of those vehicles still broke the law & deserved their punishment.
#183
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:44 PM
I know its illegal to video tape a police officer, but i would want him instructing me to remove the car from the trailer on a file before doing it.
Is it legal to refuse to remove your unroadworthy/unregistered car from your registered, roadworthy and suitable trailer being pulled by your registered, roadworthy and suitable tow vehicle if or when a police officer requests it?
Im curious in case it ever happens to me....
Is it legal to refuse to remove your unroadworthy/unregistered car from your registered, roadworthy and suitable trailer being pulled by your registered, roadworthy and suitable tow vehicle if or when a police officer requests it?
Im curious in case it ever happens to me....
Edited by Bomber Watson, 12 November 2012 - 07:44 PM.
#184
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:48 PM
if it is breaking the law.....then tmk yesI know its illegal to video tape a police officer, but i would want him instructing me to remove the car from the trailer on a file before doing it.
Is it legal to refuse to remove your unroadworthy/unregistered car from your registered, roadworthy and suitable trailer being pulled by your registered, roadworthy and suitable tow vehicle if or when a police officer requests it?
Im curious in case it ever happens to me....
works with drink driving and pub carparks
#185
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:48 PM
Good question dj
#186
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:49 PM
I have stated this elsewhere, and i believe that every car enthusiast needs to stand up, and unite to fight for our rights to enjoy our lifestyle. We all have something in common, and that's the love of cars, but if things keep going the way things are, Summernats, Powercruise etc will be nothing more than a memory.
#187
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:51 PM
I know of this practice because i was present when a friend copped it. He argued with the Police & stated his opinion on the whole affair of being targeted in the first place which probably didn't help his case, if anything made them go harder on him (which in my view doesn't make it right) but if you go back through Street Machine magazines from a few years back, you'll be able to read about this & other examples & Street Machine's response that went along the line of a protest letter to the NSW Police.
#188
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:57 PM
I know its illegal to video tape a police officer, but i would want him instructing me to remove the car from the trailer on a file before doing it.
Why???
Is it legal to refuse to remove your unroadworthy/unregistered car from your registered, roadworthy and suitable trailer being pulled by your registered, roadworthy and suitable tow vehicle if or when a police officer requests it?
Im curious in case it ever happens to me....
Just remember you have the right to refuse anything...
You will know if it is illegal when he informs you of your rights.
#189
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 08:01 PM
sorry to say DJ you have to do as you are told by a cop or risk being arrested for not complieing with an order from a police officer. Same if you don't pull up when they put their lights on behind u.
That really sucks and yes it is called entrapment.
And you can film it but it will not stand up in a cort of law as it can be docted.
That really sucks and yes it is called entrapment.
And you can film it but it will not stand up in a cort of law as it can be docted.
#190
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 08:02 PM
Some people i have been talking to, are thinking much bigger than a protest letter. Nothing illegal of course, but the time has come to say enough is enough. I love my lifestyle, some of the best times of my life have been around cars. I remember going to the Nats and seeing cops waiting for everyone to leave, and then when you got about 5k's across the 'border' into NSW, the NSW cops were waiting aswell.
#191
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 08:02 PM
one of which is to have a lawyer present....Why???
Just remember you have the right to refuse anything...
You will know if it is illegal when he informs you of your rights.
so can you voice record a police officer giving you instructions?
will this hold up in court?
#192
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 08:15 PM
sorry to say DJ you have to do as you are told by a cop or risk being arrested for not complieing with an order from a police officer.
This is what worries me.....
#193
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 08:18 PM
Don't know, they could argue that the recording is tampered with aswell. I really don't know of any way you could argue against them, unless you have a few witnesses who would be willing to stand up in court.
The whole having to do as requested is a huge worry. I think the only way you would ever know your legal rights, would be to discuss it with a lawyer that specialises in traffic law.
The whole having to do as requested is a huge worry. I think the only way you would ever know your legal rights, would be to discuss it with a lawyer that specialises in traffic law.
Edited by bumpy, 12 November 2012 - 08:23 PM.
#194
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 08:19 PM
once again yes but will not stand up in cort m8. When we fitted the cctv to our workshop we had to have it encripted so no one could alter it to have it as everdence in cort.
Other wise you are wasteing ur time
Other wise you are wasteing ur time
#195
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 08:20 PM
so can you voice record a police officer giving you instructions?
s60C Crimes Act
Collecting information about an officer (a photograph?) with the intention of using that information to assault, stalk, harass, intimidate or otherwise harm that person is an offence.
http://www.lawlink.n..._evidence_fines
Clearly, collecting information like a photo of misbehaviour to pass on to the proper authorities would not be an offence.
will this hold up in court?
There is no reason it could not be submitted as evidence.
Edited by TerrA LX, 12 November 2012 - 08:31 PM.
#196
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 08:22 PM
So could you refuse to remove the car from the trailer untill they provide a lawyer??
Like, seriously, if they can pull you up when your doing the right thing and trailering your car around, and demand you remove it from the trailer then defect/confiscate/crush/fine/whatever the frOck they like, thats pretty BS, there has to be some way you can refuse to perform an illegal action even if its instructed by a police officer.
I know Entrapment doesnt exist in Australia, an officer can sell you drugs with one hand and handcuff you for possesion with the other, but this is overstepping the mark a bit.
Where would be the best place to find out? Ask at the cop shop?
Cheers.
Like, seriously, if they can pull you up when your doing the right thing and trailering your car around, and demand you remove it from the trailer then defect/confiscate/crush/fine/whatever the frOck they like, thats pretty BS, there has to be some way you can refuse to perform an illegal action even if its instructed by a police officer.
I know Entrapment doesnt exist in Australia, an officer can sell you drugs with one hand and handcuff you for possesion with the other, but this is overstepping the mark a bit.
Where would be the best place to find out? Ask at the cop shop?
Cheers.
#197
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 08:24 PM
once again yes but will not stand up in cort m8. When we fitted the cctv to our workshop we had to have it encripted so no one could alter it to have it as everdence in cort.
Other wise you are wasteing ur time
This maybe the case if there is no eye witness but many people have used film as evidence to back their testimony.
#198
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 08:29 PM
So could you refuse to remove the car from the trailer untill they provide a lawyer?
Cheers.
No, if you refuse and if they have a legal right to move or remove something then you will be charged and or placed under arrest, you can not stop police from performing their duty unless they need a warrant to perform such duties.
#199
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 08:36 PM
Don't know, they could argue that the recording is tampered with aswell. I really don't know of any way you could argue against them, unless you have a few witnesses who would be willing to stand up in court.
The whole having to do as requested is a huge worry. I think the only way you would ever know your legal rights, would be to discuss it with a lawyer that specialises in traffic law.
Good to see you made it over here Bumpy, I have been reading your posts on gruntfiles.com with interest.
DJ, if you need a traffic law specialist, have a yarn to Potts lawyers http://www.pottslawy...fic_Law_Experts
#200
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 08:37 PM
So basically at the officers discretion its illegal to transport an unregistered/unroadworthy car on a registered, roadworthy and suitable car trailer towed by a registered, roadworthy and suitable car?
Unless theres a good reason they dont have a legal right to move/remove the vehicle in this instance?
Can they instruct you to empty the junk inside your car out (if your anything like me anything from cigarette packets to subway wrappers) onto the pavement then fine you for littering to?
Cheers.
Unless theres a good reason they dont have a legal right to move/remove the vehicle in this instance?
Can they instruct you to empty the junk inside your car out (if your anything like me anything from cigarette packets to subway wrappers) onto the pavement then fine you for littering to?
Cheers.
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