258 replies to this topic

[wot179]

Why would I stir up trouble?

Me?

Its not my style at all.

Theres so many good blokes Ive met on this forum.

Most don't even mind that I don't like Toranas.

[StephenSLR]

Most Mustang and Camaro guys or girls wouldn't know a muscle car if it bit them on the ass.

 

That's because they're not muscle cars; Mustangs and Camaros are pony cars. Many owners do know this.

 

That's why most of them have 64 to 66 Mustang's and 67 to 69 Camaro's

 

I went with a 65 because to me they are the most classy and nostalgic looking; steel dash, twin tone interior; I wanted that 60's look and feel. It's the same reason why some like their EH, EK & HR Holdens and probably the same reason you prefer a Torana over a Commodore, different era, different car.

 

and mostly basic models that came out with 200 and 250ci engines now converted to small blocks.

 

Actually the 6 models are rarer; the early Mustangs mostly came out with the 289 V8. Fuel prices weren't a concern in the US till the oil crisis hit the US in the 70's and till then, the average US family cars were V8's.

 

s

[StephenSLR]

Most of my friends parents had Aussie cars when we were growing up or Japanese car's the tough cars that were getting around were Torana's and Commodore's so that is what we all bought, no Mustang's or Camaro's in my Suburb.

 

Back then all US cars had to be converted to LHD to be registered here; conversions are very expensive and on top you had to add the import cost; most just couldn't afford to do this. Ford Australia did bring in a few Mustangs but they were never officially released here. The Mustang had the same platform as the XR Falcon and had the Mustang been released here it would've killed off the XR; something Ford Australia could not afford to do.

 

s

Edited by StephenSLR, 09 January 2016 - 03:36 PM.

[StephenSLR]

American cars are great,   if you live your life a 1/4 mile at a time....    Australian Performance cars go around corners and stop..   and thats what I like...   cheers mate ...    

 

Yep and even though I'm not a fan of Aus. Fords, you have to hand it to Moffat.

 

 

s

[yel327]

Southern Motors used to sell Pontiacs here converted to RHD. They even had special brochures etc made up.

[StephenSLR]

Southern Motors used to sell Pontiacs here converted to RHD. They even had special brochures etc made up.

 

There were a few US cars sold here RHD; a friend had an old Parisienne. There were also a few car yards in Sydney specialising in US cars. Unlike the mirror conversions that are done today, some of the old conversions seemed dodgy; under the dash was what looked like a bike chain connecting a steering column on the right to the original column on the left; these however were acceptable and approved by engineers back in the day.

 

s

[yel327]

There were a few US cars sold here RHD; a friend had an old Parisienne. There were also a few car yards in Sydney specialising in US cars. Unlike the mirror conversions that are done today, some of the old conversions seemed dodgy; under the dash was what looked like a bike chain connecting a steering column on the right to the original column on the left; these however were acceptable and approved by engineers back in the day.

 

s

 

GMH assembled and sold Chevrolet, Buick, Pontiac etc right up to US 1968 model Parisienne and Impala. These were still being sold into 1970 but were discontinued once GMH had the Statesman. The Southern Motors cars were proper US built LHD cars converted to RHD here. I've even seen price lists for them.

 

I remember those chain driven conversions, bit of a joke! A lot of Camaros were converted using HQ rails, as HQ rails were made using North American drawings but mirrored. 
 

[StephenSLR]

...most of them have 64 to 66 Mustangs

 

The most popular Mustangs here are 65-73. The 67's are a favourite due to its popularity in the movie Bullitt and there's also plenty of Mach 1 and Boss fans here too.

 

 

And again American Muscle fell short against our local L34 powered Supercar .....  

 

The XC Ford is an Aus. car

 

Ford dominated the previous year with a 1-2 finish. Holden weren't happy and upped the spending for development of the A9X. Apparently Moffat advised Ford to do the same but they refused & the rest is history.

 

s

Edited by StephenSLR, 09 January 2016 - 08:40 PM.

[StephenSLR]

Most the Mustang's I see are early.

 

Oh. I didn't realise you were speaking anecdotally. In the Mustang community Aus. wide there's a broad range of years; the most popular being 65-70. The bigger the engine the more expensive so the 65-66 is the most affordable as they're mainly 289's. The fastbacks are in general 10k more expensive than the coupes.

 

There weren't that many Aus. delivered Mustangs and are a rare find these days.

 

 

He tells me the early ones are a girls car

 

That's his ego talking; Carrol Shelby raced the early models; maybe he thinks Carrol is a girl. lol. They were never marketed as a girls car; it'd be like saying LC-LJ are a girls car because they're smaller.

 

s

[wot179]

Regardless of the owners sexual preference, or year of manufacture, pustangs are a steaming pile of shit.

[StephenSLR]

 

"Pony cars are often confused with muscle cars because they look similar and some have power.  Looks can be deceiving and the power of a pony car is to a great extent inferior to that of a muscle car.  A few well-known pony cars are the Chevrolet Camaro, Dodge Challenger, and Plymouth Barracuda.  Contrary to popular belief, the Corvettes of the 1960s era were not considered muscle or pony cars."

 

https://www.gentlema...lained-history/

 

s

[DanWA]

Always thought of LH/LX as Muscle Cars

 

Can't see how LC/LJ would fit into that though

And definitely not UC

[StephenSLR]

Here's one journalist's take on it:

 

Charger “Supercars” started and ended in the VH range. The only exceptions were the VJ E48’s, E49’s and E55’s. Why is this the case? The Supercar beat up in June 1972 effectively killed off Supercar production in Australia.

 

the term “Muscle Car” is an American one coined in the late 70’s early 80’s, and refers only to a 2 door V8 with a minimum 4 barrel Carburettor fitted with a 4 speed and developing over 300BHP.  If we accept the American view then neither the E49 or the E55 would qualify as “Muscle Cars” or indeed any Australian car from the period!

 

Where does this leave us? For all intents and purpose the E55 was marketed as a luxury Charger, it was pitched against the Fairmont Hardtop and Holden Monaro LS.

 

Write ups at the time from Wheels magazine does refer to the E55 as a supercar and compares it with the E49, this document is linked down the page. So is it or isn’t it a Factory Muscle Car?

 

In my opinion any large factory built high performance 6 cylinder or V8 engine would generally fall into the “Muscle Car” category. The hard part comes with XU1s (GMH built factory cars) As another criteria is also the size of the car for example is a Morris Mini Coopers “S” which is a factory built racing car a Muscle Car? Well I’d have to say no it isn’t.

 

If we except the view only a factory racing car is able to qualify, and in particular a Bathurst Special, then NO Vehicle built after 1972 will ever be able to claim the status of “Factory Muscle Car”.

 

http://www.e55charge...m/e55-chargers/

 

s

Edited by StephenSLR, 10 June 2017 - 07:20 PM.

[Redslur]

This arguemnt will keep going around in circles in my opinion.  To me the Aussie muslce car is different from the stereo typical Yanky muscle car. Anything with a race pedigree, a juicy V8 or raspy 6 cylinder designed for Bathurst, qualifies in my mind.  I couldn't give a stuff for any Yanky crap so don't know why people get caught up in the Muscle car debat really. Aussie muscle cars stand alone and we should all be proud of our heritage not the Yanks!!

[Ice]

This arguemnt will keep going around in circles in my opinion.  To me the Aussie muslce car is different from the stereo typical Yanky muscle car. Anything with a race pedigree, a juicy V8 or raspy 6 cylinder designed for Bathurst, qualifies in my mind.  I couldn't give a stuff for any Yanky crap so don't know why people get caught up in the Muscle car debat really. Aussie muscle cars stand alone and we should all be proud of our heritage not the Yanks!!

Spot on brother ✌️

[bullitA9X]

This arguemnt will keep going around in circles in my opinion. To me the Aussie muslce car is different from the stereo typical Yanky muscle car. Anything with a race pedigree, a juicy V8 or raspy 6 cylinder designed for Bathurst, qualifies in my mind. I couldn't give a stuff for any Yanky crap so don't know why people get caught up in the Muscle car debat really. Aussie muscle cars stand alone and we should all be proud of our heritage not the Yanks!!

Love this post and last time i checked we lived in Australia not America so yes a torana is one of Australias muscle cars period!!!

[Potta]

Yeah have to agree with these two and pretty sure I said it earlier.

 

I don't think it is as strict a category as some of us would like to believe.

 

And even if you're going to have a strict timeline, the big engined cars here were a few years behind the US anyway, eg late 60's and through the 70's so you know, whatever.

 

Also an Aussie Muscle Car does not fit the original definition given but is a category of its own and in my opinion includes all of the race-bred Toranas.

[Covert]

I agree. frOck all the strict bullshit

Toranas are Aussie muscle. Simple.