6 replies to this topic

[Beans 73]

Hi guys, thought I would share what I found when scrounging around for a brake booster for the LJ. The car was a 'high faith', un-boosted, drum/drum machine until then.

 

After missing out on a pricey VH 235 on ebay, I stumbled across a rusty old VH200 booster on Gumtree and found I could use that. The VH200 booster was fitted on drum brake all-round HK's and is a single 230mm booster like the LC's VH212

 

The key to finding out that I could use the VH200 was finding the  ATAP Exchange Boosters PDF  http://www.eziautopa...f/Mastervac.pdf

 

Page 31 for Torana and page 29 for HK,T,G say that both the drum/drum HK and the LC can use a VH212. What is hidden is the fact that some or all of the HK's were originally fitted with a VH200, which was latter superseded by the VH212. This information appears on pg 78. 

 

Once I was able to get an LC/LJ brake booster mounting bracket for the firewall and dice the HK bracket (still got it if someone needs it), I was able to get the HK booster and 'big nut' master cylinder reconditioned, to whack in the baby J, with some XU1 discs. Stops like a blowy on fly paper now!

 

Note the 'Drum' stamped on the big nut.

 

Hope this helps someone avoid extortion on an exorbitantly priced VH212 or VH235.

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[S pack]

What I find strange is you say the VH200 suits DRUM/DRUM brakes and their catalogue states VH200 is superseded by VH212 which is a Master Vac to suit DISC/DRUM in HK and LC.

That catalogue appears to be incomplete and a bit misleading.

If VH200 is definitely for DRUM/DRUM it should be superseded by VH218 which is the equivalent DRUM/DRUM Master Vac and is not suited to DISC/DRUM applications.

 

You say the car now stops like a Blowy on flypaper now.  Is the brake pedal very touchy and feel like it will throw you through the windscreen if you are not careful with how hard you depress the pedal?

[Beans 73]

Hi Dave,

 

I am relying on the accuracy of the catalogue, which may be questionable, don't know.

 

The Supersession and Cross Reference table on pg 78 says to use VH212 in place of a VH200, and VH212 can be used on DISC/DRUM LC and DRUM/DRUM HK according to pages 31 and 29.

 

Seems like Holden used single diaphragm boosters on HK-T-G for DRUM/DRUM applications, but double diaphragms (similar to XU1) for the DISC/DRUM cars.

 

Not sure which cars the VH218 was used on , but pg 78 says the VH212 is the replacement for it, so it could probably also be used on a LC/LJ, with the appropriate master cylinder for a VH212. Do you know where the VH218 was used Dave?

 

Car stops really well, and brakes are not overly touchy, with a nice solid pedal. Don't think I've had them locked yet, but having staggered tyres with 225's at the back helps. Thought I could get away without swapping out the DRUM/DRUM rear wheel cylinders, but the engineers were right, you need the ones to match the hydraulics of having discs on the front.

 

Cheers, Beans.

[S pack]

The LC Torana parts catalogue lists VH218 as the booster for 6cyl Power assisted DRUM/DRUM brakes and VH212 as the booster for 6cyl (excl XU1) with DISC/DRUM.

VH 212 & VH 218 both have the 8mm pushrod protrusion to suit the rounded end HK,T,G and 1st type LC master cyl.

 

Late in LC production the new square ended HQ master cyl superseded the round ended m/cyl and VH 218 for Power assisted DRUM/DRUM brakes was accordingly changed to VH 234 and VH212 for DISC/DRUM changed to VH 235.

VH 234 & VH 235 carried through to the end of LJ production.

 

Similarly the VH 317 double diaphragm booster in the LC XU1 changed to VH 324 with the HQ square ended m/cyl.

VH 324 carried through to the end of LJ XU1 production.

 

That booster catalogue lists VH 316 as the booster for LC XU1 which is incorrect.

My understanding is that you should not use a Master Vac unit designed for DRUM/DRUM brakes with DISC/DRUM and vice-versa.

The HK parts catalogue lists different part numbered single diaphragm boosters for cars fitted with DRUM/DRUM brakes to those fitted with DISC/DRUM.

That brake booster catalogue implying that you can use a booster designed for DRUM/DRUM brakes on a vehicle with DISC/DRUM is incorrect.

 

Hopefully Datto will be able to shed more light on the subject.

 

Perhaps you told your booster repairer that you were fitting the VH 200 and master cyl to an LJ Torana with DISC/DRUM and they accordingly swapped out the DRUM brake rear pushrod assy, valve body and reaction disc with the appropriate parts to suit with DISC brakes.

Edited by S pack, 03 November 2022 - 12:37 AM.

[Beans 73]

Thanks Dave. Very comprehensive.

 

The repairer refurbishing the VH200 was aware I was converting to disc/drum, as I bought the XU1 discs from them. They must have 'saved my bacon' putting in the right parts in the booster.

 

I didn't know Holden specifically used different boosters for drum/drum and disc/drum cars, as I thought drum brake cars didn't come with boosters at all, as my LJ didn't have a booster, just master cylinder bolted straight to the firewall! When I saw that HK drum/drum was boosted I assumed it was because it was a bigger car. The usually reliable Holden wrecker I asked about HK boosters said that "all HK-T-G boosters were tandem", so I figure single boosters off them might not be very common now!

 

My reconditioner used the big nut master cylinder that came with the VH200, but I had to get a new primary and secondary piston parts for him. The supplier, Holdenman Restomotive just described them as "PR HK-G 'GMH' Master Cyl pistons". I'm glad they were the right ones to go in a drum/drum master cylinder.

 

All seems to be working ok, thankfully. Perhaps others need to be careful using that ATAP Exchange Boosters PDF as it has a few errors.

 

Cheers for your input Dave. 

[dattoman]

Most catalogues are full of errors

 

Many of the catalogues are copies of copies.. .some are even ones I wrote

Most of the ones we use at work I wrote 20+ years ago

 

I know about the errors. I sometimes put them in deliberately to see who's copying who !!

 

There's so many different part #'s and secessions it would do your head in

While there are slight internal differences most don't matter anymore as you can only buy so much in the way of repair parts

Remember PBR ceased to exist when bought by Bosch mid 90's

So 20+ years of other aftermarket companies supplying stuff.. .and they don't supply it all due to limited market

[Beans 73]

Yes I will take that on board for when looking at catalogues in the future. Thanks Dave and dattoman. 

 

It amused me seeing the master cylinder straight on the firewall, instead of the usual booster I had on my other disc toranas.

 

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